Glossary entry (derived from question below)
French term or phrase:
usine à gaz
English translation:
convoluted mess; impenetrable jungle
Added to glossary by
ormiston
Oct 28, 2015 17:31
8 yrs ago
8 viewers *
French term
usine à gaz
French to English
Marketing
Marketing / Market Research
feedback from survey by fast food chain
C'est une usine à gaz.
This is how a restaurant manager describes the parent company. He is obviously critical of its complexity. I wonder if someone can come up with an equivalent term...(no joy from the glossary).
This is how a restaurant manager describes the parent company. He is obviously critical of its complexity. I wonder if someone can come up with an equivalent term...(no joy from the glossary).
Proposed translations
(English)
Proposed translations
+4
1 hr
Selected
convoluted mess
A suggestion.
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Note added at 17 hrs (2015-10-29 11:09:39 GMT)
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According to Google:
"convoluted
ˌkɒnvəˈl(j)uːtɪd/
adjective ...
1. (especially of an argument, story, or sentence) extremely complex and difficult to follow.
"the film is let down by a convoluted plot in which nothing really happens"
synonyms: complicated, complex, involved, intricate, elaborate, impenetrable, serpentine, labyrinthine, tortuous, tangled, Byzantine, Daedalian, Gordian; More
confused, confusing, bewildering, baffling, puzzling, perplexing;
informalfiddly, plotty;
rareinvolute
"an extraordinarily convoluted narrative"
antonyms: simple, straightforward
2. technical
intricately folded, twisted, or coiled.
"walnuts come in hard and convoluted shells"
... late 18th century: past participle of convolute, from Latin convolutus, past participle of convolvere ‘roll together, intertwine’ (see convolve)."
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Note added at 17 hrs (2015-10-29 11:17:39 GMT)
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www.yourinsurance.co.uk/blog/.../can-you-be-a-generic-busin...
Even a small company can become a convoluted mess by the time it starts collating more diverse roles into individual people.
www.independent.co.uk/.../what-a-fine-mess-blairs-got-himse...
Why has the British government got into such a convoluted mess? Its equivocations would be more credible if Blair had not adopted such a ...
www.readytogo.net › Forums › Sunderland Message Boards › SMB
This is evident, however I fail to understand why anyone would choose the convoluted mess that is Android over the intuitive and superior iOS.
www.adventurecreator.org/forum/.../gamepad-as-mouse-cursor-...
... feel free to send me packing. My project is becoming a bit of a convoluted mess of plugins and assets, and I'm trying to keep them all in order.
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Note added at 18 hrs (2015-10-29 11:47:16 GMT)
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Not necessarily a mess, but not good either unless it's deliberately convoluted to hide something:
www.wsj.com/articles/SB1183930551965602569 Jul 2007 - PARIS
Talks to streamline the convoluted management structure at European Aeronautic Defence & Space Co. have the potential to ease ...
https://books.google.co.uk/books?isbn=0994846207
Colleen Cross - 2015 - Fiction
Kat traced her finger along one axis of the spider web of companies in ... due to his convoluted ownership structure, but on paper it was as clear as day. He owned Regal Gold Mines through Westside Investments. He couldn't hide it any longer.
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Note added at 17 hrs (2015-10-29 11:09:39 GMT)
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According to Google:
"convoluted
ˌkɒnvəˈl(j)uːtɪd/
adjective ...
1. (especially of an argument, story, or sentence) extremely complex and difficult to follow.
"the film is let down by a convoluted plot in which nothing really happens"
synonyms: complicated, complex, involved, intricate, elaborate, impenetrable, serpentine, labyrinthine, tortuous, tangled, Byzantine, Daedalian, Gordian; More
confused, confusing, bewildering, baffling, puzzling, perplexing;
informalfiddly, plotty;
rareinvolute
"an extraordinarily convoluted narrative"
antonyms: simple, straightforward
2. technical
intricately folded, twisted, or coiled.
"walnuts come in hard and convoluted shells"
... late 18th century: past participle of convolute, from Latin convolutus, past participle of convolvere ‘roll together, intertwine’ (see convolve)."
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Note added at 17 hrs (2015-10-29 11:17:39 GMT)
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www.yourinsurance.co.uk/blog/.../can-you-be-a-generic-busin...
Even a small company can become a convoluted mess by the time it starts collating more diverse roles into individual people.
www.independent.co.uk/.../what-a-fine-mess-blairs-got-himse...
Why has the British government got into such a convoluted mess? Its equivocations would be more credible if Blair had not adopted such a ...
www.readytogo.net › Forums › Sunderland Message Boards › SMB
This is evident, however I fail to understand why anyone would choose the convoluted mess that is Android over the intuitive and superior iOS.
www.adventurecreator.org/forum/.../gamepad-as-mouse-cursor-...
... feel free to send me packing. My project is becoming a bit of a convoluted mess of plugins and assets, and I'm trying to keep them all in order.
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Note added at 18 hrs (2015-10-29 11:47:16 GMT)
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Not necessarily a mess, but not good either unless it's deliberately convoluted to hide something:
www.wsj.com/articles/SB1183930551965602569 Jul 2007 - PARIS
Talks to streamline the convoluted management structure at European Aeronautic Defence & Space Co. have the potential to ease ...
https://books.google.co.uk/books?isbn=0994846207
Colleen Cross - 2015 - Fiction
Kat traced her finger along one axis of the spider web of companies in ... due to his convoluted ownership structure, but on paper it was as clear as day. He owned Regal Gold Mines through Westside Investments. He couldn't hide it any longer.
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Alain Bolduc
: Here's some context for the expression: http://www.linternaute.com/expression/langue-francaise/14247...
23 mins
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Thanks Alain
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| agree |
Daryo
: It's not quite that - the idea is more of some exaggerated complexity - but I like it! Attracts attention for sure, so it's fit for purpose.
2 hrs
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Thanks Daryo. See note added above, which supports "exaggerated complexity" as a meaning for "convoluted".
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| agree |
Nikki Scott-Despaigne
: I didn't know this epxression but it is instantly understandable and a good match for the ST meaning. ("Convoluted" perfectly describes complexity with "mess").
5 hrs
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Thanks Nikki. 162,000 ghits for "convoluted mess", including 24,400 UK ones.
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| agree |
Jeffrey Henson
: Like it !
1 day 2 hrs
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Thanks Jeff.
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "I used convoluted, with your host of cited examples proving it hit the spot. I also liked Sheila's suggestion and Nikki's spot on définition. Seems a few translators have learnt a new expression!"
12 mins
Chakib Roula
Algeria
Algeria
Native in French
Specializes in field
Algeria
Shedding light out of words
Native in: Arabic 
, French
Works in: Arabic to French, Arabic to English, French to English, and 3 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
4
Labyrinthine system
Suggestion
4 hrs
polyglot45
Native in French
&
English
Native in: English , French
Works in: English to French, French to English, German to French, and 4 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
44
bureaucracy gone mad
bureaucracy run riot
4 hrs
Nikki Scott-Despaigne
Native in English
Psychologist, Court-certified legal
Native in: English 
Works in: French to English
Related KudoZ points
:
19
white elephant
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_elephant
Probably rather more approrpiate for hare-brain projects ad/or expensive projects that are just a waste of time.
Probably rather more approrpiate for hare-brain projects ad/or expensive projects that are just a waste of time.
4 hrs
Nikki Scott-Despaigne
Native in English
Psychologist, Court-certified legal
Native in: English
Works in: French to English
Related KudoZ points
:
19
neither use nor ornament ; to get nowhere fast
Another expression sometimes used to describe a set-up which makes a lot of noise but achieves nothing.
In conext, you might even be able to say : "is getting us nowhere fast."
In conext, you might even be able to say : "is getting us nowhere fast."
3 hrs
a case of Parkinson's Law gone out of control
..
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Note added at 10 hrs (2015-10-29 03:51:29 GMT)
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large companies do tend to generate internal bureaucracy than can be as nightmarish as the state bureaucray
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Note added at 10 hrs (2015-10-29 03:51:29 GMT)
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large companies do tend to generate internal bureaucracy than can be as nightmarish as the state bureaucray
+2
16 hrs
Sheila Wilson
Spain
Spain
Native in English
Specializes in field
Spain
20 years producing 100% natural English
Native in: English (Variant: British)
Works in: English, French to English
Related KudoZ points
:
28
impenetrable jungle
https://www.google.es/url?q=http://www.dailymail.co.uk/scien...
This very first result from a Google search seems highly relevant.
This very first result from a Google search seems highly relevant.
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Jennifer White
: yes, it does seem relevant. Like this one./ No, I meant I like it!!
52 mins
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Thanks Jennifer. Did you mean to add a link? / :)
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| agree |
Carol Gullidge
: I like this if you're not wishing to sound TOO derogatory about one's parent company. This just says it all without going OTT. Also fits very well with Nikki's Reference comment
1 hr
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Thanks Carol
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17 hrs
a proper maze
their (parent company's) system is a proper maze
only stressing the complexity of their procedures, without giving too much negative connotations.
only stressing the complexity of their procedures, without giving too much negative connotations.
Reference comments
4 hrs
Nikki Scott-Despaigne
Native in English
Psychologist, Court-certified legal
Native in: English
Works in: French to English
Related KudoZ points
:
19
Reference:
I like this short article on the expression
A bit of history and examples of current usage.
http://www.lefigaro.fr/politique/le-scan/decryptages/2015/07...
pressions favorites des politiques : «Usine à gaz»
HOME LE SCAN LES DÉCRYPTAGES
Par Marc de Boni Mis à jour le 21/07/2015 à 10:21 Publié le 21/07/2015 à 06:00
Vue d'une usine à gaz - une vraie - à Reichstett, en Alsace.
LE SCAN POLITIQUE - A la faveur de l'été, Le Scan politique vous propose de décrypter une expression récurrente dans le discours des politiques. Aujourd'hui, la tentaculaire «usine à gaz».
Qu'est-ce qui peut aussi bien désigner la «démocratie participative» initiée par Ségolène Royal en amont de la présidentielle de 2007 , la réforme fiscale voulue par Michel Sapin, l'organigramme des Républicains, le programme sécuritaire de Chirac en 2002 ou encore l'actuelle réforme territoriale ? L'expression «usine à gaz». Très prisée depuis longtemps par les politiques de tous bords, cette formule métaphorique caractérise aujourd'hui des dispositifs incompréhensibles pour le commun des mortels, dont la mise en oeuvre a pour seul mérite de complexifier un sujet qui l'est déjà suffisamment...
Cette expression trouve son origine à l'aube de la révolution industrielle du début du XIXème siècle. Les grandes capitales d'Europe occidentales se dotent alors progressivement de l'éclairage au gaz pour améliorer la salubrité et la sécurité urbaine. À Paris et Londres notamment se développent de vastes complexes industriels à la tuyauterie massive et alambiquée. Leur fonctionnement complexe et souvent dangereux leur valent une fort mauvaise réputation. Si l'éclairage au gaz est tombé en désuétude au profit de l'électricité dès les années 1880, l'image forte de ces complexes industriels tentaculaires restera gravée dans la mémoire collective. Au point de devenir une expression péjorative courante.
Un exemple? Le Grand Paris
En politique, la notion d'«usine à gaz» est employée pour dénigrer un projet jugé trop cher, trop complexe, et dont le mode de fonctionnement paraît inaccessible aux non-initiés. Un projet politique affublé de ce qualificatif répond souvent aux notions également dénoncées par le terme «bureaucratique». L'expression a d'ailleurs rencontré un franc succès pour désigner les appareils d'État aux effectifs pléthoriques et aux objectifs parfois obscurs.
Presque qu'aucun politique n'a résisté à l'attrait de cette expression pour dénigrer un projet adverse. Un exemple en vidéo: en janvier 2008, à l'occasion de la première conférence de presse présidentielle du quinquennat de Nicolas Sarkozy. Manuel Valls, alors député d'opposition, commente les dispositifs de défiscalisation des heures supplémentaires fraîchement mis en place par le gouvernement...
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Note added at 4 hrs (2015-10-28 22:05:33 GMT)
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Just in case it inspires someone.
http://www.lefigaro.fr/politique/le-scan/decryptages/2015/07...
pressions favorites des politiques : «Usine à gaz»
HOME LE SCAN LES DÉCRYPTAGES
Par Marc de Boni Mis à jour le 21/07/2015 à 10:21 Publié le 21/07/2015 à 06:00
Vue d'une usine à gaz - une vraie - à Reichstett, en Alsace.
LE SCAN POLITIQUE - A la faveur de l'été, Le Scan politique vous propose de décrypter une expression récurrente dans le discours des politiques. Aujourd'hui, la tentaculaire «usine à gaz».
Qu'est-ce qui peut aussi bien désigner la «démocratie participative» initiée par Ségolène Royal en amont de la présidentielle de 2007 , la réforme fiscale voulue par Michel Sapin, l'organigramme des Républicains, le programme sécuritaire de Chirac en 2002 ou encore l'actuelle réforme territoriale ? L'expression «usine à gaz». Très prisée depuis longtemps par les politiques de tous bords, cette formule métaphorique caractérise aujourd'hui des dispositifs incompréhensibles pour le commun des mortels, dont la mise en oeuvre a pour seul mérite de complexifier un sujet qui l'est déjà suffisamment...
Cette expression trouve son origine à l'aube de la révolution industrielle du début du XIXème siècle. Les grandes capitales d'Europe occidentales se dotent alors progressivement de l'éclairage au gaz pour améliorer la salubrité et la sécurité urbaine. À Paris et Londres notamment se développent de vastes complexes industriels à la tuyauterie massive et alambiquée. Leur fonctionnement complexe et souvent dangereux leur valent une fort mauvaise réputation. Si l'éclairage au gaz est tombé en désuétude au profit de l'électricité dès les années 1880, l'image forte de ces complexes industriels tentaculaires restera gravée dans la mémoire collective. Au point de devenir une expression péjorative courante.
Un exemple? Le Grand Paris
En politique, la notion d'«usine à gaz» est employée pour dénigrer un projet jugé trop cher, trop complexe, et dont le mode de fonctionnement paraît inaccessible aux non-initiés. Un projet politique affublé de ce qualificatif répond souvent aux notions également dénoncées par le terme «bureaucratique». L'expression a d'ailleurs rencontré un franc succès pour désigner les appareils d'État aux effectifs pléthoriques et aux objectifs parfois obscurs.
Presque qu'aucun politique n'a résisté à l'attrait de cette expression pour dénigrer un projet adverse. Un exemple en vidéo: en janvier 2008, à l'occasion de la première conférence de presse présidentielle du quinquennat de Nicolas Sarkozy. Manuel Valls, alors député d'opposition, commente les dispositifs de défiscalisation des heures supplémentaires fraîchement mis en place par le gouvernement...
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Note added at 4 hrs (2015-10-28 22:05:33 GMT)
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Just in case it inspires someone.
Peer comments on this reference comment:
| agree |
philgoddard
: That's very helpful, thanks.
7 hrs
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| agree |
Victoria Britten
: Thanks!
8 hrs
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| agree |
mchd
: très bonne idée de recherche !
11 hrs
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| agree |
Jeffrey Henson
: Thanks for sharing this Nikki !
23 hrs
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Discussion