| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6] > | What about a forum for women and mothers? Thread poster: Silvia Barra (X)
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| Other places besides Proz.com | Jun 3, 2009 |
Evija Rimšāne wrote:
there are many other sites out there dedicated specifically to women problems, raising children and cooking (or whatever else).
| | | | Laureana Pavon 
Uruguay
Local time: 10:05
Member (2007)
English to Spanish
+ ...
MODERATOR | You can already discuss these issues, no changes are needed | Jun 3, 2009 |
Els Hoefman wrote:
It would be great if there were an appropriate forum for questions like this. Would it be a good idea to create one - I mean independently from Proz? I would be in favour - I would even be willing to start a forum if there is enough interest.
Why not start a thread in the "off-topic/other" category? I think that's the best solution and one you can implement right away
| | | | | I agree with Damian | Jun 3, 2009 |
I have no vested interest, as I have no children (nor do I want any) - but a couple of the responses to Silvia's proposal are extremely offensive, in my opinion.
I see nothing wrong with the idea of a forum specifically for working parents (I agree that it should not be restricted to mothers) or even parents and carers. Comments such as
I don't think that discussions about pampers will help us and our business.
and
Translation: thé profession for working mums.
and
And why not cat owners - mine takes up more time than my son ever did!
are unconstructive and contemptuous. Even as a non-parent, I can think of a number of professional parenting issues which it might be useful to discuss in a dedicated forum. Jared's response that it is outside the scope of Proz is perfectly reasonable, but suggesting that anything which touches on parenting is unprofessional - or even off-topic - is an insult to the scores of professional translators here who are also parents.
| | | | Samuel Murray
Netherlands
Local time: 15:05
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
| +1 for freelancer lifestyle forum | Jun 3, 2009 |
ViktoriaG wrote:
However, I think that the forum would exclude too many people. Instead, what could probably be done is to create a forum on freelancer lifestyle. This would certainly include about 99% of the site's users and it would be in line with the forum scope as it would deal with living day to day as a freelance translator (or reviewer or subtitler or voice artist, whatever).
I agree.
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| Well look at those statements. | Jun 3, 2009 |
I frankly cannot see the pain such a forum could possibly create for anyone.
Exception: Annoying statements of people whose only business is to pop by and bitch about the mere idea.
> Translation: The Profession for working mums?
Like those. This is the only point against it that I can come up with.
Edit: Seems we rather lack an "I feel like the worst a**hole today and wish to cave in to it"-forum. ... See more I frankly cannot see the pain such a forum could possibly create for anyone.
Exception: Annoying statements of people whose only business is to pop by and bitch about the mere idea.
> Translation: The Profession for working mums?
Like those. This is the only point against it that I can come up with.
Edit: Seems we rather lack an "I feel like the worst a**hole today and wish to cave in to it"-forum.
[Bearbeitet am 2009-06-03 23:36 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Anne-Marie Grant (X)
Local time: 14:05
French to English
+ ...
| I totally agree with Viktoria | Jun 3, 2009 |
that a forum addressing the issues of the freelancer-lifestyle could be very useful to many of us us. I also appreciate Marie-Hélène's generous post. As for Pampers man....words fail me.
| | | | Jaroslaw Michalak
Poland
Local time: 15:05
Member (2004)
English to Polish
SITE LOCALIZER | Freelance lifestyle | Jun 3, 2009 |
Fourthing or fiving that...
It would be nice to know how other people are working at home, how are they coping with home+office problems, etc. Even pictures of workspaces could be nice! (With the possible exception of mine - it is too cluttered!).
| | | | | I agree with Viktoria- | Jun 3, 2009 |
and am stunned by the poisonous comments of
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| I agree with Viktoria- | Jun 4, 2009 |
a freelancer lifestyle forum would be helpful to all and sundry.
As for the poisonous comments about working mothers- I am stunned by the nastiness and even more so by the cruel stupidity of such a comment. What's professional about that type of absurd generalization? Really, with apologies for my manners to my own working mother, who taught for 30 years, who pissed in your cornflakes this morning?
| | | | Laura Tridico
United States
Local time: 09:05
French to English
+ ...
| I agree with Victoria as well. | Jun 4, 2009 |
A column for parents is far to narrow, but a place to discuss the freelance lifestyle (with its pros and cons) could be very helpful and interesting.
As for the comments, this issue has come up before, and there are always those who seem to equate motherhood with being a lousy/amateur translator. Very enlightened. When I see comments like that, I don't even know what to say in response to such an outdated and uninformed world view. So I guess I'll just get back to work.
... See more A column for parents is far to narrow, but a place to discuss the freelance lifestyle (with its pros and cons) could be very helpful and interesting.
As for the comments, this issue has come up before, and there are always those who seem to equate motherhood with being a lousy/amateur translator. Very enlightened. When I see comments like that, I don't even know what to say in response to such an outdated and uninformed world view. So I guess I'll just get back to work.
Laura ▲ Collapse
| | | | | unconstructive and contemptuous? | Jun 4, 2009 |
Marie-Hélène Hayles wrote:
I have no vested interest, as I have no children (nor do I want any) - but a couple of the responses to Silvia's proposal are extremely offensive, in my opinion.
I see nothing wrong with the idea of a forum specifically for working parents (I agree that it should not be restricted to mothers) or even parents and carers. Comments such as
I don't think that discussions about pampers will help us and our business.
and
Translation: thé profession for working mums.
and
And why not cat owners - mine takes up more time than my son ever did!
are unconstructive and contemptuous. Even as a non-parent, I can think of a number of professional parenting issues which it might be useful to discuss in a dedicated forum. Jared's response that it is outside the scope of Proz is perfectly reasonable, but suggesting that anything which touches on parenting is unprofessional - or even off-topic - is an insult to the scores of professional translators here who are also parents.
How you expect me to write constructive and complimentary words about a subject which frankly includes feminism and separation?
I have answered with the same message.
Also I am surprised why this topic still not removed/locked?
Because the first forum rule says:
Valid topics for discussion include language and language services (translation, interpreting, localization, subtitling, etc.), as well as business and technical issues of interest specifically to language professionals in their work. Postings which are not related to language or translation, or the business of language or translation, are not allowed. Postings which are political, religious, or otherwise controversial in nature, or that may be considered offensive by other users, will be removed without regard to the views expressed.
May be poster has no direct ill-intentions but this topic against the site rules.
So, must I be polite with such idea in which I see feminism, sexual discrimination and separation?
| | | | | Being a 'working-linguist': dual-lives; being 'a part-timer', 'working mother', etc; 'pin-money' | Jun 4, 2009 |
Greetings Silvia
What about a forum for 'part-timers'? That's 'professional' and might find a following. Would it meet the situation you are thinking of? There are already forums for Students ...
IMO there are various types of 'working linguists'. Many peers are 'part-time', possibly. Some peers may double as tour-guides, nurses, gardeners, chefs, and so on and so on (it could be anything) or as housewives/house-husbands ...
Lesley
Alternativ... See more Greetings Silvia
What about a forum for 'part-timers'? That's 'professional' and might find a following. Would it meet the situation you are thinking of? There are already forums for Students ...
IMO there are various types of 'working linguists'. Many peers are 'part-time', possibly. Some peers may double as tour-guides, nurses, gardeners, chefs, and so on and so on (it could be anything) or as housewives/house-husbands ...
Lesley
Alternatively, what about starting a thread on 'Mothers' etc in this Forum? :
http://www.proz.com/forum/being_independent-18.html
@ jyuan
Yep, some of the peers are (or have become) 'working-mothers/fathers' etc. (working-grandparents?) Might be nice to have a Forum about this type of 'dual' lifestyle (domestic + professional) perhaps.
Perhaps the topic initiator is 'gauging/canvassing support', or wants a 'multilateral consensus', or is doing a 'preliminary float' of the idea? If the Italian Community supports it, and if it seems that 'the time is right', yeah, why not just 'go for it' (ie put a request through to Management ...).
@ williamson et al.: translation: a women's profession? yeah, IMO the idea that it is acceptable to pay a self-employed woman 'pin-money' may still exist in some quarters ...
[Edited at 2009-06-04 06:56 GMT] ▲ Collapse
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Selcuk Akyuz
Türkiye
Local time: 16:05
English to Turkish
+ ...
| what about this rule | Jun 4, 2009 |
M. Ali Bayraktar wrote:
I disagree.
I don't think that discussions about pampers will help us and our business.
Thanks M. Ali, for reminding us the rules. But what about this rule http://www.proz.com/siterules/general/3#3
Advertisements are prohibited. (...)
Hope you are not advertising Pampers manufactured by Procter & Gamble
My favourite is Prima, but Huggies is also a good choice.
| | | | Damian Harrison (X)
Germany
Local time: 15:05
German to English
| Regarding discrimination | Jun 4, 2009 |
Again, Silvia wrote:
Silvia Barra wrote:
With this suuggestion I don't want to discriminate or offend anyone, since my request does not mean to restrict the participation at the forum to some categories.
I'm available to further discuss this idea, and I hope it can be useful for ProZ community.
Thank you
Silvia
Ali, there is no intention of discrimination in Silvia's posting nor is anyone in fact discriminated against. If you feel otherwise, please outline the specific issue.
Feminism? Where?
Separation? Where? How? The fact that you are able to participate in this discussion undermines the very argument. Unless I missed something Silvia did not propose a mechanism for locking out male members.
Polite? When? You belittled Silvia's suggestion.
Silvia is a language professional, just like you and everyone else here. The degree of her professionalism is not to be measured by her desire to communicate with other language professionals on a subject of professional interest - namely how to balance professional roles with broader family needs.
The proposed lifestyle forum is neither of a political, religious or controversial nature.
And just to add a little twist to things, let's remember Mill: We can never be sure that the opinion we are endeavoring to stifle is a false opinion; and if we were sure, stifling it would be an evil still.
[Edited at 2009-06-04 03:25 GMT]
| | | | | Point of view | Jun 4, 2009 |
Damian Harrison, M.A. wrote:
Again, Silvia wrote:
Silvia Barra wrote:
With this suuggestion I don't want to discriminate or offend anyone, since my request does not mean to restrict the participation at the forum to some categories.
I'm available to further discuss this idea, and I hope it can be useful for ProZ community.
Thank you
Silvia
Ali, there is no intention of discrimination in Silvia's posting nor is anyone in fact discriminated against. If you feel otherwise, please outline the specific issue.
Feminism? Where?
Separation? Where? How? The fact that you are able to participate in this discussion undermines the very argument. Unless I missed something Silvia did not propose a mechanism for locking out male members.
Polite? When? You belittled Silvia's suggestion.
Silvia is a language professional, just like you and everyone else here. The degree of her professionalism is not to be measured by her desire to communicate with other language professionals on a subject of professional interest - namely how to balance professional roles with broader family needs.
The proposed lifestyle forum is neither of a political, religious or controversial nature.
And just to add a little twist to things, let's remember Mill: We can never be sure that the opinion we are endeavoring to stifle is a false opinion; and if we were sure, stifling it would be an evil still.
[Edited at 2009-06-04 02:25 GMT]
I have not any problem with the author of the idea. (It is impossible as I even don't know her) And my words have not been directed to writers/modificators of the original idea but to the idea itself.
There is not any proposed lifestyle forum here please read the name of this thread "What about a forum for women and mothers?".
And, accept it or not pampers will be one of the subjects of such kind of forum (with a high degree of probability)
Subjects about emotions, feelings and interior worlds are not important in such professional workplaces. (those who wish are welcome to use Off-Topic forums here)
Do you know any company, institution or another workplace where you can go with your child and your child will be running in the office while you work? How can you react if in your company when you waste all your efforts for developing the business, making investment for the future and somebody thinks about butterflies, bees?
We already have problems in this world for gaining enough respect to our business "Translation" and such things really bring damage to all of us.
This site is important for me, I love this place (even if I sometimes can not show my love in a good behaviour). Sometimes my opinions are not in line with the majority and may be incorrect, but here, in this situation, I know that I am right (if there is anyone who thinks that letting workers bringing emotional, family issues to the work is right thing and in line with the professionalism, I would be glad to know his/her point of view in order to compare with mine and learn other aspects)
As for the feminism, sexual discrimination and separation:
I see those things when I am just reading the written text but not focusing on who wrote it. If any doubt please try to implement it in your company, then you will see how many trial cases you will face with opened by the other workers. Also please pay attention that the proposed forum will be used only by women and mothers.
Results of such implemetation here will bring infinite combinations (men, fathers, haired, bold, etc)
So, I am focusing only on the idea, it is not important who proposed it. This idea and it's modification is very dangerous.
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