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Glossary entry

German term or phrase:

Weiße Messe (rel.)

English translation:

White Mass

Added to glossary by Lonnie Legg
Sep 28, 2009 12:34
14 yrs ago
German term

Das wird eine Weiße Messe

German to English Other Idioms / Maxims / Sayings Dentistry
"„Das wird eine Weiße Messe“ wurde im Vorfeld seitens der Industrie verkündet, ich frage mich nur welcher Patient, Zahntechniker oder Zahnarzt hat sich eine Weiße Messe gewünscht.
Natürlich ist eine Messe, gerade so eine bedeutende wie die IDS, auch eine Innovationsshow.
Aber ob das dort gezeigte, der Königsweg der Zahntechnik in die Zukunft ist darf doch bezweifelt werden. Wir sind nun mal keine Drucker oder Weber, die sich mit ähnlichen arbeitserleichternden Produkten selber wegrationalisiert haben. Nein wir fertigen Unikate für Menschen an. Einzellanfertigungen die ein Patient mindestens 75% des Tages im Gebrauch hat. Über den Einfluss von Ästhetik und gepflegtem Erscheinungsbild auf die Psyche und / oder die Kariere sind ganze Bücher geschrieben worden so daß ich mich hierzu wirklich nicht auslassen muss."

From some kind of dentistry text (although it seems to be more incoherent rambling). I haven't got the faintest idea what "Das wird eine Weiße Messe" means. Is it some kind of idiom that I've never heard of? Or is there a pun going on with Messe=mass/Messe=trade fair? TIA for any light you can shed on this extremely odd phrase.
Proposed translations (English)
2 +1 It will be a white mass.
3 It will be a white trade fair
2 White Coat Exhibition Drill
References
Weiße Masse
Change log

Oct 1, 2009 10:48: Lonnie Legg Created KOG entry

Discussion

Anne-Marie Grant (X) Sep 28, 2009:
If you did want to do a play on words you could use 'a mass of white' or 'masses of white' to convey the whiteness of the fair, as opposed to 'a White Mass' which could mean either a service to pray for the wellbeing of dentists and their patients or, as Lonnie says, something with slightly more occult undertones. You did say your text was incoherent!!
Helen Shiner Sep 28, 2009:
David but I think it would be useful if they did, otherwise there would be little point in posting here!!
David Williams Sep 28, 2009:
Thanks Helen I just wanted to make sure that nobody unwittingly made a connection to the architecture of the trade fair centre in Hamburg or Dresden.
Helen Shiner Sep 28, 2009:
David I am not talking about where the IDS is; I am presenting other instances of the term, which if you read my links, are in Hamburg and Dresden.
David Williams Sep 28, 2009:
Neither Hamburg nor Dresden IDS is in Cologne (cf. http://www.ids-cologne.de/ )
Jeff James (X) Sep 28, 2009:
Ooops, I missed Anne-Marie Grant's entry (13.11) – which I find very convincing –before adding mine.
Nicole Schnell Sep 28, 2009:
Odd play on words: Schwarze Messe, Graue Messe Springs to my mind spontaneously. Aside from this thigh-slapper, I found this: A White Mass, sponsored by the diocesan Catholic Medical Association.
http://www.doy.org/viewpast.asp?ID=1912
Jeff James (X) Sep 28, 2009:
Isn't it just a double word game? On the one hand the advertisers/ promoters are making – as David Williams points out –reference to the world of medicine and/or white teeth, while on the hand the author is stressing the more sinister occult overtones of "white mass". Just my tuppence worth. Of course translating it isn't easy. Maybe playing with "white heat" as in "the white heat of technology"?
Helen Shiner Sep 28, 2009:
@ Lonnie sorry, my post was confusing. I have found quite a few connections to Hamburg, but have not posted them all, but as my other post re Dresden indicates, it is not Hamburg only where this term occurs.
Lonnie Legg Sep 28, 2009:
Re architectural project "Weiße Messe": @Helen Since the IDS trade fair seems to be in Cologne (http://english.ids-cologne.de), I don't see a connection with the Hamburg Messe (to which, in your article, the term "Weiße Messe" is descriptively applied).
Helen Shiner Sep 28, 2009:
Another instance of the term It doesn't seem to be a pun but a term that is used to describe a legitimate type of trade fair. Here in Dresden:
http://www.shv-oberelbe.de/Hafenbriefe_1_07.pdf
I wonder if it is light industry or something like...
Anne-Marie Grant (X) Sep 28, 2009:
A White Mass is a liturgy for healthcare workers where, traditionally, they wear white. Can't get the link to work, but if you type White Mass into Google you'll see it. Also, your text asks which patient/medic might have wanted 'eine weiße Messe' for themselves. I think this may well be some kind of pun on the double meaning of Messe.
Helen Shiner Sep 28, 2009:
When searching for this term I keep coming back to Hamburg. In this case, again, it sounds as if it is the name of an architectural project:
http://www.stahlbau-nachrichten.de/Archiv/Stana_2008_01.pdf

See p.22 - apologies if this is just adding further confusion...
Ingeborg Gowans (X) Sep 28, 2009:
referring to their products? another long shot: I was re-reading the text, and as far as I understand it it is referring to dentures.. so maybe it is referring quite literally to "white" teeth or dentures"?
The site that Helen mentioned is also a possibility: an innovative show, pristine white? maybe? Just a few thoughts...
David Williams Sep 28, 2009:
For men in white coats? Maybe it's a reference to the fact that it's a medical fair, primarily for medical personnel, i.e. "men in white coats"?
Helen Shiner Sep 28, 2009:
Looks like a genuine term I know i have come across this before, but can't for the life of me remember what it means - frustrating...

http://www.baunetz.de/meldungen/Meldungen_Grundsteinlegung_f...
David Williams Sep 28, 2009:
When does the fair take place? I know it's a long shot, but might it be a slanted reference to Christmas, like "I'm Dreaming Of A White Christmas"?

Proposed translations

+1
57 mins
Selected

It will be a white mass.

Given the sardonic tone of the text, my guess is that the writer has sardonically twisted a term ("Weiße Messe")--apparently used in marketing this specific trade fair (I would guess in reference to either the white dental parts/products/uniforms/all of the above)--to question the fair's potential to impact the future of dental practice.
Weiße Messe/white mass--in a sarcastic reversal of the occult meaning of the term: a ceremony invoking powers to benevolently manipulate fate (here: the future of dentistry).
Or am I totally off here?
Peer comment(s):
neutral Helen Shiner : This may well work for the second instance of the term, but I don't think it would for the phrase as announced by Industrie//But the term appears twice in the sentence given above - with two separate meanings. That was all I was indicating.
19 mins
Right, my post is meant to help Rowan understand his writer's use of "Messe", not to translate an industry slogan. It being neither certain (despite the quotes) nor significant whether the writer is quoting (or paraphrasing) an actual advertising slogan.
agree David Williams
21 mins
neutral Jeff James (X) : agree with Helen Shiner
17 hrs
see my response to Helen.
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "The points should really go to Anne-Marie here, because I ended up using her "mass of white/white mass" phrasing. If the client doesn't like my choice, I shall be pointing them to this question and stressing what an obscure and highly confusing term it is. But if a joke is being made in the German text, then some sort of pun is retained in the English version. Many thanks to all and Happy Translation Day!"
1 hr

White Coat Exhibition Drill

Firstly, I would avoid "White Mass" as it has different connotations.

To maintain the deeply sarcastic tone, the combination between "white coat" and the military term "exhibition drill" came to my mind. Also, you would have a neat play on words regarding "drill". :-)

Something went wrong...
18 hrs

It will be a white trade fair

'weiße Ware' being the general term for household appliances, and 'white appliances' and 'white appliances market' both being in use, I would think that industry was using 'Weiße Messe' to indicate the nature of what visitors should expect to find there, i.e. dentistry equipment
Reference:

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wei%C3%9Fe_Ware#Wei.C3.9Fe_Ware

Something went wrong...

Reference comments

1 hr
Reference:

Weiße Masse

I don't think it is a joke or a pun. This may be a translation but it indicates that neither are intended:

The future look of the new
Hamburg Messe was subject to an
international architectural competition
involving urban and open
space planning elements, initiated
in October 2002. Six months later,
the jury voted for the concept, designed
by Dusseldorf architect
Christoph Ingenhoven: a new
“white“ fair in the centre of Hamburg,
open and transparent to reflect
the Hanse city’s cosmopolitan
atmosphere.
www.hamburg-messe.de
http://www.hamburg-economy.de/res/downloads/hn0303e.pdf
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