Glossary entry (derived from question below)
French term or phrase:
fond de l’être
English translation:
abyss of being
Added to glossary by
Laura Molinari
Dec 22, 2010 21:58
13 yrs ago
French term
Canada
16 years of experience, highly reliable
Native in: English
Works in: French to English, Spanish to English, English to Spanish
fond de l’être
French to English
Art/Literary
Philosophy
Nietzsche
Le second s’incarne dans la figure de Dionysos, fils de Zeus et de Sémélé; dieu de la vigne, du vin, de l’ivresse. Il est du côté des forces fondamentales de l’existence, du côté de la vie et du fond de l’être.
It's a document analyzing Nietzsche's views on art and artists.
It's a document analyzing Nietzsche's views on art and artists.
Proposed translations
(English)
Proposed translations
1 day 3 hrs
Selected
abyss of being
Straight out of The Birth of Tragedy.
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Note added at 1 day3 hrs (2010-12-24 01:32:18 GMT)
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Sorry about the backslashes in the French "example sentence":
Le “je” du poète lyrique se fait donc entendre du fond de l'être : sa “subjectivité” au sens où l'entend l'esthétique moderne est une illusion.
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Note added at 1 day3 hrs (2010-12-24 01:40:37 GMT)
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Here's a more direct link to the English version of the passage by Nietzsche:
http://books.google.com/books?id=ufCCJUFo-LMC&printsec=front...
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Note added at 1 day16 hrs (2010-12-24 14:21:04 GMT)
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It's a stretch for me, but this looks like the original German for the text I've cited:
Das “Ich” des Lyrikers tönt also aus dem Abgrunde des Seins: seine “Subjectivität” im Sinne der neueren Aesthetiker ist eine Einbildung.
http://books.google.com/books?id=VaA7AAAAYAAJ&pg=PA81&dq="Di...
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Note added at 1 day3 hrs (2010-12-24 01:32:18 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Sorry about the backslashes in the French "example sentence":
Le “je” du poète lyrique se fait donc entendre du fond de l'être : sa “subjectivité” au sens où l'entend l'esthétique moderne est une illusion.
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day3 hrs (2010-12-24 01:40:37 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Here's a more direct link to the English version of the passage by Nietzsche:
http://books.google.com/books?id=ufCCJUFo-LMC&printsec=front...
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day16 hrs (2010-12-24 14:21:04 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
It's a stretch for me, but this looks like the original German for the text I've cited:
Das “Ich” des Lyrikers tönt also aus dem Abgrunde des Seins: seine “Subjectivität” im Sinne der neueren Aesthetiker ist eine Einbildung.
http://books.google.com/books?id=VaA7AAAAYAAJ&pg=PA81&dq="Di...
Example sentence:
Le “je” du poète lyrique se fait donc entendre du <b>fond de l\\\'être</b> : sa “ subjectivité” au sens où l\\\'entend l\\\'esthétique moderne est une illusion
The “I” of the lyric poet thus echoes out of the <b>abyss of being</b>. What recent aestheticians mean by his “subjectivity” is mere fantasy.
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Unfortunately this answer came in after I had to deliver my translation and I had used 'primordial being' but now that I've seen this and searched online, I'm quite sure it's the right term. Thanks to all!"
50 mins
Marco Solinas
Native in English
Accurate, professional translations
Native in: English 
, Italian
Works in: Italian to English, French to English
Related KudoZ points
:
4
the essence of the self
:-)
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
philgoddard
5 hrs
|
| disagree |
Melissa McMahon
: I don't see how you get this...
9 hrs
|
+1
1 hr
Yvonne Gallagher
Ireland
Ireland
Native in English
Ireland
right word, right place. everytime
Native in: English (Variants: Irish, UK, US, Canadian) 
Works in: French to English, Spanish to English, English, and 1 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
8
primordial being/archetypical man
...the very basis of life itself
‘In Dionysian art and its tragic symbolism . . . nature cries to us with its true undissembled voice: "Be as I am! Amid the ceaseless flux of phenomena I am the
eternally creative primordial mother, eternally impelling to existence, eternally finding
satisfaction in this change of phenomena!"’
File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - Quick View
by R Luyster - Cited by 1 - Related articles
Nevertheless, it is to Dionysus and Dionysian mythology that Nietzsche turns ... The ability of the artist to create the image that annuls suffering, then, ...
www.vahidnab.com/dion.pdf
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Note added at 1 hr (2010-12-22 23:43:33 GMT)
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In The Birth of Tragedy (1872), the German philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche contrasted Dionysus with the god Apollo as a symbol of the fundamental, unrestrained aesthetic principle of force, music, and intoxication versus the principle of sight, form, and beauty represented by the latter. Nietzsche also claimed that the oldest forms of Greek Tragedy were entirely based on suffering of Dionysus. Nietzsche continued to contemplate the character of Dionysus, which he revisited in the final pages of his 1886 work Beyond Good and Evil. This reconceived Nietzschean Dionysus was invoked as an embodiment of the central will to power concept in Nietzsche's later works The Twilight of the Idols, The Antichrist and Ecce Homo.
Nietzsche continued to contemplate the character of Dionysus, ... as an archetype for the character Tori by contemporary artist Tori Amos in her 2007 album ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dionysus - Cached - Similar
Nietzsche is thinking of Apollo and Dionysus not as phenomena but as disembodied ... either as Apollonian dream-artist or Dionysian intoxicated-artist or ...
books.google.com/books?isbn=0521002958...
Nietzsche is thinking of Apollo and Dionysus not as phenomena but as disembodied ... either as Apollonian dream-artist or Dionysian intoxicated-artist or ...
books.google.com/books?isbn=0521002958...
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Note added at 1 hr (2010-12-22 23:44:40 GMT)
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books.google.com/books?isbn=0521002958...
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2010-12-22 23:46:06 GMT)
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sorry links notworking!Although Nietzsche and Wedekind have different conceptions of the artist, he epitomizes for both not only Dionysian man, but also the inherent tragedy in ...
www.jstor.org/stable/2907863 - Similar
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Note added at 1 hr (2010-12-22 23:47:14 GMT)
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Nietzsche's Apollonianism and Dionysianism is one of the philosophy in which ... Even an artist can be either Apollonian or Dionysus art because Apollo and ...
www.bachelorandmaster.com/.../apollonianism-dyonysianisism.... - Cached - Similar
‘In Dionysian art and its tragic symbolism . . . nature cries to us with its true undissembled voice: "Be as I am! Amid the ceaseless flux of phenomena I am the
eternally creative primordial mother, eternally impelling to existence, eternally finding
satisfaction in this change of phenomena!"’
File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - Quick View
by R Luyster - Cited by 1 - Related articles
Nevertheless, it is to Dionysus and Dionysian mythology that Nietzsche turns ... The ability of the artist to create the image that annuls suffering, then, ...
www.vahidnab.com/dion.pdf
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2010-12-22 23:43:33 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
In The Birth of Tragedy (1872), the German philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche contrasted Dionysus with the god Apollo as a symbol of the fundamental, unrestrained aesthetic principle of force, music, and intoxication versus the principle of sight, form, and beauty represented by the latter. Nietzsche also claimed that the oldest forms of Greek Tragedy were entirely based on suffering of Dionysus. Nietzsche continued to contemplate the character of Dionysus, which he revisited in the final pages of his 1886 work Beyond Good and Evil. This reconceived Nietzschean Dionysus was invoked as an embodiment of the central will to power concept in Nietzsche's later works The Twilight of the Idols, The Antichrist and Ecce Homo.
Nietzsche continued to contemplate the character of Dionysus, ... as an archetype for the character Tori by contemporary artist Tori Amos in her 2007 album ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dionysus - Cached - Similar
Nietzsche is thinking of Apollo and Dionysus not as phenomena but as disembodied ... either as Apollonian dream-artist or Dionysian intoxicated-artist or ...
books.google.com/books?isbn=0521002958...
Nietzsche is thinking of Apollo and Dionysus not as phenomena but as disembodied ... either as Apollonian dream-artist or Dionysian intoxicated-artist or ...
books.google.com/books?isbn=0521002958...
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2010-12-22 23:44:40 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
books.google.com/books?isbn=0521002958...
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2010-12-22 23:46:06 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
sorry links notworking!Although Nietzsche and Wedekind have different conceptions of the artist, he epitomizes for both not only Dionysian man, but also the inherent tragedy in ...
www.jstor.org/stable/2907863 - Similar
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2010-12-22 23:47:14 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Nietzsche's Apollonianism and Dionysianism is one of the philosophy in which ... Even an artist can be either Apollonian or Dionysus art because Apollo and ...
www.bachelorandmaster.com/.../apollonianism-dyonysianisism.... - Cached - Similar
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
fionn
: Primordial being, yes! Archetypal (not archetypical) man, no...
3 hrs
|
|
thank you Fionn, agree with your comment. Happy Holidays:-)
|
|
| neutral |
Melissa McMahon
: yes, as per fionn, primordial being could work well, but not archetypal man...
8 hrs
|
|
Thanks Melissa, Happy Holidays
|
5 hrs
Gabriella Bertelmann
Native in English
Certified Translator/Reviewer 35Y f.t.
Native in: English , German
Works in: German to English, English to German, French to English, and 5 more.
at the foundation of 'Being'
another variance
as in the foundation of existence/being
as in the foundation of existence/being
+2
10 hrs
Melissa McMahon
Australia
Australia
Native in English
Specializes in field
Australia
Related KudoZ points
:
86
depths of being
Since Dionysus is about drunkenness, formlessness - this is how Nietzsche understands him, as opposed to Apollo, the god of form, I would suggest something like the heart, core or depths of being rather than its foundation, which sounds too sober/rationalist I think.
-1
13 hrs
philippe vandevivere
France
France
Native in French
Works in field
France
PhD Biotech & process engineer
Native in: French
Works in: Dutch to French, English to French, Spanish to French, and 3 more.
on the side of human nature
:)
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