Jan 11 16:06
4 mos ago
55 viewers *
English term

speak into

English Other Religion
The church was told to speak into culture prophetically.
Votes to reclassify question as PRO/non-PRO:

Non-PRO (1): AllegroTrans

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Discussion

@Yvonne and Domini Thanks for telling us, Yvonne; didn't even notice. I, for one, appreciate your reply and Domini's and I enjoyed the discussion; one can never learn enough =)

As the Q is indeed problematic without more context (and I also don't think we're going to get more), I'll bow out here too but not before wishing you both a sunny weekend!

Best
Domini Lucas Jan 31:
@Yvonne I do agree with you re shame we didn't get more context. It's been useful thinking for me in any case as one forgets knowledge when it's not used! However, with more context, we might not have needed this length of discussion to try to work it out. I hope you are keeping well. :-)
Domini Lucas Jan 31:
@Bjorn Sorry life got busy and I've not received notifications for some reason. Without reading your links (just now), the Pentecostal folk I had on my team when I worked as a Chaplain did consider themselves a separate denomination, however it is possible it may vary. I'll do some digging when I get a chance as it is my field so I ought to tidy up my knowledge! (I went to theological college and have worked as an Anglican Chaplain in the past). Charismatic Christians tend to be found across denominations and really Charismatic Christianity is more of a 'movement' i.e. you can have Charismatic Catholics or Charismatic Anglicans, etc. It's based on a specific understanding/experience of the charismatic "gifts of the Spirit" mentioned by St Paul in his 1st letter to the Corinthians 12:8-10. This is usually a belief also held Pentecostal Christians, from memory at least. As said I must do some digging. Will make a note to read your links properly this week. This is all partly why I think the question somewhat problematic, especially without more context, as some of these aspects don't necessarily make sense without specific inside knowledge of Church matters. As with many fields, of course!
@ all Asker couldn't be bothered to give any further context and just declined all so I stopped bothering as I was busy and apparently wasting my time, Though these discussions can be interesting sometimes there is little point when we are not given fiull context.
@ Björn @ Domini I didn't mean to restrict it solely to the "congregation" though I think the message being imparted would be addressed not only to it but also to the culture of the wider community
Anyway, thanks all for the discussion and shame the asker can't be bothered to give context or say thanks for our efforts.
Björn Vrooman Jan 25:
@Domini Many thanks, both for your detailed responses and the links.

Theology isn't my field (haven't chimed in on many of the other religious Qs, just this one because of the potential political overtones) so I learned something new RE the use of prophecy.

As for the denominational aspect: Further down, you said "denominational, i.e. Charismatic and/or Pentecostal." As hinted at above, I'm not well-versed in the intricacies of church organization, but I did look for differences between, e.g., Pentecostal and Anglican and got sent here:
https://denominationdifferences.com/compare/anglican-vs-pent...
https://ccx.org.uk/content/anglican-pentecostal-dialogue/

If it were anything like the Catholic-Protestant ecumenical relations, my guess would have been that Pentecostal and Anglican must be two denominations.

But as one of the answerers said here:
"'Pentecostal' is not as much of a denominational designation like the word 'Anglican' is. (Unless you are specifically referring to a denomination that uses the word Pentecostal in its name.) In fact, there is such a thing as 'Pentecostal Anglicans.'"
https://www.quora.com/What-difference-is-there-between-Pente...

Best
Domini Lucas Jan 24:
@Bjorn your focusonthefamily link and comments Yes, this does seem to fit a does your explanation. In which case, to my mind there is a sense of 'how do we engage with' (perhaps adding 'and affect'), providing it retains a sense of communicating God's word for 'the now' of the recipient culture (terrible English - sorry!) I purposely wrote word lower case w as though I agree that it may involve pointing out that the Bible has the answers, it may also refer to a prophetic message that aligns with the Bible but is expressed directly without referring to specific passages.
Domini Lucas Jan 24:
re communicate and influence the use of the prophetic gift is communication of God's message and may influence by having a life changing impact on the recipient and/or by effecting transformation or change. But speaking prophetically in the general sense can have the sense of predicting the future. Prophets or those with prophetic gifts within the Church may have a 'picture' or 'vision' of what might happen in the future (as did some of the Old Testament prophets at times as well), but it's not always the case. They may just have a message to deliver without knowing why. Also cf. Jonah whose message to the Ninevites led them to repent and change. https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Jonah 3&version... So in the @Asker's context the Church may be being called to say something to the culture that leads it to change, or that could cause it to understand itself better. If it's purely in a wider sense it could be predicting its future, but that is unlikely given the way that 'speak into' is used in more Charismatic/Pentecostal settings). In any case, communicate is definitely part of it, but not enough or it would be the word used, or it would just say deliver a message from God.
Domini Lucas Jan 24:
re Prophecy; also @Bjorn Here's a link which gives an idea of how prophecy can have different meanings: https://www.davidmccracken.org/office-of-a-prophet/. The middle one "The Gift of Prophecy" description includes these words: "The gift of prophecy may include speaking out or writing God's "Now Word", the burden of His heart;" It doesn't use speak into but it is one of the ways in which the gift of prophecy would be communicating God's word to an individual or culture in their specific context, if the expression is being used in a narrower sense. This kind of prophetic gift tends to be referred to by Pentecostal or Charismatic Christians. @Bjorn that's what I had in mind when I mentioned denominational (though Charismatic Christians cross denominational divides). The Anglican Church includes different churchmanships as you no doubt know. I haven't read all your links yet, but will tomorrow or ff. Definitely not just US English though. I heard it on a UK English programme the other night and have heard it in church contexts in the UK, though usually lower church when used in the narrower sense: "Those who have the gift of prophecy are those who make known the mind, will and intention of God."
Daryo Jan 22:
Yes, what I've said might sound oversimplified and if you look at the larger picture there is always a two-way communication, at least to some extent.

But I was referring ONLY to the specific sentence, which is about exercising influence, not the other way round.
Björn Vrooman Jan 19:
They believe that the culture war is almost lost because they've let the "left" gain an upper hand (don't speak to them about Hollywood and the like) by not engaging but leaving everyone to their own devices.

Stopping one side from obliterating the other (as dramatic as it may sound) will, of course, require a more aggressive approach so I believe the wider context, as you've mentioned, would be really important to know.

On a side note, "speak into" is also being used in combination with other nouns:
"Here are some questions to ask yourself and perhaps ask others that you have given permission to speak into your leadership."
https://churchexecutive.com/archives/shaping-culture

"But while we are wise to be discerning in whom we let speak into our lives, we are always to believe the best about people. This includes leaders."
https://fullfocus.co/5-truths-to-remember-when-your-leader-f...

There's always a reference to Christianity in there somewhere, which means to me the phrase hasn't really gained general currency, but I'd say, in this kind of context, its meaning lies somewhere between "communicate" and "influence."

Best wishes and, to all of you, have a great weekend!
Björn Vrooman Jan 19:
[...] I'm fine with it being applied to a wider audience--after all, you do want to increase the size of your flock. One way to do this is to...

(a) try to understand where someone's coming from, what their life is like;
(b) speak to them on their level, using their language; and
(c) pointing out to them how the Bible provides answers to their questions.

That is roughly what I thought Yvonne meant (and what you echoed in your reply to my post) and it is pretty convincing--outside of conservative circles.

As for the orthodox or conservative interpretations of the phrase, especially in the US, I think the following sums them up pretty well:
"The truth is our culture has been chipping away at the Judeo-Christian value system for decades. Increasingly, the Christian viewpoint is unwelcome in public settings...How do we live courageously in a culture that wants to silence us?...How do we speak into a culture where the person who shouts the loudest wins the argument?"
https://jimdaly.focusonthefamily.com/engaging-the-culture-wi...

To conservatives, it's about the waning influence of religion; that's something most have in common on that side of the aisle.

[...]
Björn Vrooman Jan 19:
Apologize... ...for replying so late, but the week has been a bit chaotic.

@Domini
Not sure it's denominational; St Georges Epsom (see the NZ link) is an Anglican church. Funnily enough, its vicar, Josh Jones, is also a punk singer (and originally from the UK): https://www.localmatters.co.nz/health/punk-vicar-to-play-coa...

So I may have guessed wrong about US churchgoers being the only ones using the term, though it comes up quite often on American websites.

As said elsewhere, I used to read a lot of news articles and blog posts published by conservatives in the US (being part of a German-American household, I just wanted to understand their perspective a bit better).

And while some of those articles were studded with religious references, I don't remember ever seeing "speak into" in print (or online) so Yvonne shouldn't feel bad about not having come across it either =)

Also, from what I've read (now), I do think Yvonne's communicate "(with people on their own level and within their own cultural norms)" is a good fit; not certain why she's limiting it to "congregation" in her replies to you and Daryo.

[...]
Domini Lucas Jan 16:
@Yvonne I hope all's well with you. Wanted to add a quick note to one of your comments below but couldn't, hence note here. I just wanted to say that I don't think "culture" refers specifically to a congregation. It may include a church congregation(s), which is inevitably related to the culture that corresponds to its time and place, but I think culture is wider. Again, it would be easier to answer this if we had a few more sentences/wider context.
Domini Lucas Jan 12:
@Daryo I agree with some of what you say, but not that communication from the Church is unidirectional and that the outside culture is only to listen. It's about relationships and trying to connect culture with God and mediate His love (I know that is not always achieved, perceived or evident in practice, but that is the purpose). The Church is in a sort of sandwich trying to hold together/form a bridge with what it believes to be God's perspective and view as laid down in either Scripture, Church canons or both (emphasis dependent on churchmanship) and where people/culture are at. Historically church and culture have been more aligned or less so at different times. But Church training is to try to listen to God, culture and individuals whom, the Church believes, God knows and understands from the inside and more fully than any human can. Without listening to culture/individuals, Church communication is impossible, whether effective or not cf. for example https://www.thelisteningchurch.com/ https://togetherforthecommongood.co.uk/from-jenny-sinclair/t... I found the links quickly, so have not read them in their entirety. Just offering as egs. of "the listening church."
Domini Lucas Jan 12:
Reference entry re purpose of prophetic ministry The context of the link in the reference entry is the kind of individual prophecy I alluded to previously in passing. However, it gives a definition of the prophetic that applies to the Church corporately as well. That the prophetic purpose is to deliver a message to the recipient (individual or corporate i.e. culture, institution, whatever) conveying a message from God to that recipient to connect that recipient to God and His perspective and, likely, have an effect on the recipient/change them. So the message is 'spoken into' the present specific context/time/culture, rather than randomly or irrelevantly. God speaking into the world is a recurrent Biblical theme. He spoke Creation into existence (Gn. 1., Ps. 33.9 etc); spoke through the Biblical prophets "into" the culture of the day, Jesus the Word of God (communication of the Father into the world), speaks through the Holy Spirit, etc. The Church is meant to be one of the vehicles through which God speaks His message to the world in which He is ever present and current. His purpose is always to connect with His world (individually and collectively) and to draw it back into relationship with Himself.
Domini Lucas Jan 12:
@Bjorn Your eden.co.uk does echo the sense of affecting/influencing culture (rather than mirroring it), which is what I think it probably means if general. (See my first discussion entry below).
The Church is meant to set values, not just follow the non-Church values, habits, lifestyle, etc. To be 'in the world but not of the world'.
Domini Lucas Jan 12:
@Asker Would you be able to offer a little more context please? And are you actually asking for an alternative phrase/rendition, or just to understand the meaning?
@discussion re American or not: it may also be denominational, i.e. Charismatic and/or Pentecostal. (cf. also @Bjorn's charsismanews link) In which case having more context might clarify whether it is a general comment re the (wider) church influenciing culture (which I suspect is more likely) or whether individuals within certain church settings or contexts might be being asked to "deliver" what would be considered a direct message from God. It does sound more general here, however certain church contexts do include modern-day 'prophetic ministry' (if that doesn't mean much in short hand, I can expand - but unnecessary unless the provision of more context makes it a likely explanation).
Björn Yes, you're right. I Googled "speak into" meaning and got 3 Ghits. When I drop "meaning" (which was not within the original apostrophes BTW) I get more hits.
I agree with you that it seems to be used in some American religious texts. I never saw it before :-(
Björn Vrooman Jan 11:
I don't know... ...what search engine everyone's using, but I get way more than a few hits. All of them seem to be ENS:
https://www.churchandculture.org/blog/2017/6/26/finding-our-...
https://www.stgeorgesepsom.org.nz/wp-content/uploads/2019/11...
https://www.eden.co.uk/christian-books/personal-life/social-...

etc. etc.

And I'm pretty sure this is the source of the asker's quote:
"'I told The New York Times that the church of Jesus Christ and culture have always been at odds, and that we need to understand that the church was never called to accommodate culture,' he says. 'The church was called to prophetically speak into culture.'"
https://www.charismanews.com/marketplace/86772-megachurch-pa...

It's an American thing, I guess.

Best
Toni Castano Jan 11:
Could this be the source? "Christ and Crisis" by Charles Malik, written in 1962. See below:
https://www.paul-gould.com/2012/06/13/christianity-in-the-21...
Malik believed that there was a crisis of his age that must be addressed so that there would be a viable Christian voice (to speak into culture) and Christian conscience (to give shape to culture). What was the crisis of the age, according to Malik (writing in 1962):[2]
That sentence is quite bizarre English and I really don't know what it means. Context?

Responses

-3
0 min

address

Declined
In this context, "speak into" translates as "address" because it implies communicating directly and purposefully with the culture to deliver a prophetic message or guidance.

Example sentences:
1. The leader addressed the congregation, reminding them to speak into society's injustices with love and compassion.
2. As a writer, she aims to address pressing issues in her novels, speaking into the hearts and minds of her readers.
3. The activist group plans to speak into political debates, offering their perspective and urging for change.
This is an AI-generated answer.
Peer comment(s):

neutral Ezz Eldeen Mohammad : Welp, I guess I'm useless now
3 mins
disagree Yvonne Gallagher : once again AI shows how convincing it can be at waffling
58 mins
disagree Björn Vrooman : Agree with Yvonne. Also, as always, the example sentences are pure fiction.
2 hrs
disagree Daryo : A village fool would be more entertaining.
1 day 22 mins
Something went wrong...
57 mins

comment on, talk about

Declined
looks like bad English and really makes very little sense. And you have given no surrounding sentences that would help devipher it.

Only 3 Ghits for "speak into culture" and adding "prophetically" just one!

We use "speak into " for speaking INTO a device like a microphone or phone but otherwise it's "speak ON"=comment, or "speak ABOUT/TO" = address

At first, I thought they maight have wanted to say "talk into" = persuade or convince, as many non natives get "talk" and "speak" confused


I suggest foretell, predict for the "prophetically" part

The church was told to speak into culture prophetically >
The church was told to comment on culture in the future >
The church was told to address the issue of culture in the future>
The church was told to predict/foretell what would happen to culture

but more context IS needed

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2024-01-11 17:07:31 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Sorry! typo 2nd line: should be "decipher"

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 6 hrs (2024-01-11 22:54:27 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

OK so I think I understand it better now having read some more.

This seems to be a particular meaning in religion to do with getting people to understand where the church is working/what it's doing/what are its intentions or aims while the church in turn tries to understand where/how people are within their own culture and lives and thus come to a better mutual understanding

https://www.stgeorgesepsom.org.nz/wp-content/uploads/2019/11...


"Because the more we engage with culture, the more we can understand culture.
The more we understand culture, the more we can speak into culture.
And the more we can speak into culture
the more we can communicate our FAITH, IN CULTURE."
=======================================
Anyway, the word I'd use now would probably be COMMUNICATE (with people on their own level and within their own cultural norms)
Peer comment(s):

neutral Christopher Schröder : Also a pretty high confidence level for pure guesswork 😂
39 mins
My CL is not 100% and I didn't make an AI-type statement as to meaning
neutral Domini Lucas : Not a prediction. Or commenting on/talking about. Being prophetic connects and has an effect. Maybe communicate but not sure that's sufficient on its own. Pls see discussion entries.
8 hrs
yes, my first comments were not fully on point until I read further. Communicate or act as a bridge/medium between God and the congregation in the current times
neutral Daryo : "to communicate" would be the nearest, but when it comes to (any) religion, the "communication" tends to be rather unidirectional (/one-sided), so "spreading the word / our truth" would be more accurate.
23 hrs
I think the "into" implies some sort of attempt to have multidirectional communication so as to have a better chance of influencing the congregation. Acting as a bridge/medium in other words
Something went wrong...
+1
1 day 42 mins
English term (edited): The church was told to speak into culture prophetically

The church was told to influence culture by spreading its prophecies

Declined
Clue:
"I told The New York Times that the church of Jesus Christ and culture have always been at odds, and that we need to understand that the church was never called to accommodate culture," he says. "The church was called to prophetically speak into culture."
https://www.charismanews.com/marketplace/86772-megachurch-pa...

IOW what this pastor meant:

the church's "calling" was to infuse its prophecies into the outside culture. The church is meant to do the "speaking" and (the outside) culture to do the "listening", NOT the other way round.

BTW, this logic makes perfect sense from the viewpoint of this church, as it would make sense from the viewpoint of any religion / cult / ideology that all seek to expand their influence.
Peer comment(s):

neutral Domini Lucas : I agree with influence, not with spreading. Prophecy is not usually about "expanding" influence/imposing ideology. c.f. some of the Biblical prophets whose lives were not at all easy. The influence is usually about effecting a change of heart/direction.
1 hr
This sentence is not about the prophecies themselves, but about prophecies used as content of the message to send out with the intent of the message landing INTO "the culture".
neutral Yvonne Gallagher : What on earth does "spreading prophecies" mean? I don't agree it's all one-sided but rather that a church is supposed to act as some sort of bridge between God and the congregation
3 days 21 hrs
"spreading prophecies" = "prophecies" are the content of the message being spread around - is it really necessary to expand the abbreviated form? // It is one-sided in this sentence.
agree Susana E. Cano Méndez
47 days
Something went wrong...

Reference comments

8 hrs
Reference:

Purpose of prophetic ministry

“Prophecy is a message from God, spoken through one person, and shared with another. This message points both people – the speaker and the listener – back to God”
...
"When you learn how to prophesy over someone, one of the very first things you should understand is this: Prophecy is very much God’s word for now. It is the “sword of the spirit” in Ephesians 6:17 that speaks into today, or not at all.

In the same passage, the Bible itself could be described as the “belt of truth”. However, the bible is the general, universal, or eternal word of God.

While there are biblical principles that always apply to our lives, the relevance of a specific Bible verse to you or me, right now, depends on many factors.

A given prophecy may utilise the words of the Bible but always applies them in the moment.

The prophetic message may be shared in any format, being spoken, written, drawn, or even acted out. But it will always reveal something about God.

The message may well disclose something about the person on the receiving end, but it will leave no doubt that it was from the Lord, not from any earthly source.

It’s all about God’s presence.

What I mean by that is that God himself is present in every true prophecy, through his Spirit, in the here and now. He is the originator, the destination and the active agent of any prophetic message."
Peer comments on this reference comment:

neutral Daryo : It's a good example of what would be the content "spoken into" s.t. outside the church, but it doesn't explain what "speaking into" would mean.
17 hrs
I agree. Still hoping for more context. Hope you are well. :-)
Something went wrong...
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