Apr 13, 2023 10:58
1 yr ago
33 viewers *
English term

Bull Dog Bend

Non-PRO English Art/Literary Poetry & Literature Minnie Bruce Pratt
A man mutters: It's a card game. Too
candid. They know what's in your hand.
I look down. My hands dangle open and empty
in the harsh yellow light. Strange men,
familiar, laugh and curse in the kitchen, whiskey,
ending over cards. Or is it something held down
on the table? Someone says: Bull Dog Bend.
Someone says: The place of the father in the home.
A woman's voice: Those women who've never held
a little baby in their arms. In the old window,
a shadow. Two hands, brick and mortar, seal
the house, my children somewhere inside. The youngest
has lost his baby fat, navel flattened, last
of my stomach's nourishing.
Votes to reclassify question as PRO/non-PRO:

PRO (1): Yvonne Gallagher

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Discussion

Kourosh Fallah Apr 15, 2023:
Childless marriage, instead of lesbian? I concur with Katalin. However, I don't think it refers to lesbians. The writing is about the experience of childlessness in women. They could be talking about it. Bull Dog Bend could be a veiled derogatory reference to a childless marriage.
Christopher Schröder Apr 14, 2023:
Katalin’s suggestion sounds very plausible to me It would be very odd to include it without a double meaning
Katalin Horváth McClure Apr 13, 2023:
Possible double meaning? Given that the poem is about a lesbian woman and her struggles with her own family and the community, I think it is possible that "Bull dog bend" was uttered as a distorted version of "bulldagger" (perhaps intentionally distorted, but understood by the others, especially in that local community as an inside joke). "Bulldagger - Most often used in a derogatory way to describe a masculine lesbian" - see more here: https://books.google.com/books?id=bbcBCgAAQBAJ&pg=PA329&lpg=...
I know this seems far-fetched, but if we look/read carefully, the other two sentences after this are referring to lesbians or their situations in stereotypical and deregatory terms.
Again, may be overthinking it, so I am just bringing this up as extra input for the asker to consider.
https://www.google.com/books/edition/Bearing_Life/U5bcW5AbmY...
Kourosh Fallah Apr 13, 2023:
... If someone says, "9/11 changed US history forever," 9/11 here definitely means the event, not the date.
Kourosh Fallah Apr 13, 2023:
@Yvonne Thanks for the info. The question asks for opinions about the term's meaning, not giving translations, so I can't see how this can be overtranslation, etc.!

Also, considering the 'parallel structures' and 'balance' in literature, it seems plausible that answers are of similar nature. This is not a wild guess.

The asker has asked about the possible meaning of the phrase, and I just provided documented possibilities. If this is for a translation, the non-American readers would probably have no idea about that place or related concepts. IN THAT CASE, The best practice could be to provide information in a footnote, explicitly saying (the translator's comment).

Have a nice day.
Yvonne Gallagher Apr 13, 2023:
@ Kourosh You are just making guesses at what this place means to the author = over extrapolation/overtranslation

up to the reader to do their own research and decide what the whole thing means, for them

This comes from a book "Bearing Life: Women's Writings on Childlessness"
Kourosh Fallah Apr 13, 2023:
Replying to @Yvonne Gallagher's comment "Someone says: Bull Dog Bend.
Someone says: The place of the father in the home.
A woman's voice: Those women who've never held
a little baby in their arms."
The answers seem (to me) to be related or somehow of similar nature. The other ones are not the names of places.

Responses

+5
10 mins
Selected

name of place in Alabama

it's capitalised and the author is from Alabama

https://minniebrucepratt.net/about/

https://www.bluetoad.com/publication/?i=37829&article_id=388...


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Note added at 6 days (2023-04-20 08:57:21 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

Thanks for letting me know

Guesswork can be dangerous

Voting this as Pro as I had to look it up
Note from asker:
Thanks, I thought about this and found that they both connected to Alabama, but as I see the place called Bulldog Bend and not Bull Dog Bend and I hesitated because it seems weird why she would write it wrong. I also thought maybe it has some connection with the poker. The whole poem is about the situation where the poet lost her custody over her two sons because she came out as a lesbian at 70s.
Peer comment(s):

agree Kourosh Fallah : Agreed.However, considering the context, it might also refer to a train accident happened there // https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQJIozhHvIU // or the canoeing experience in the canoeing park// https://www.facebook.com/bulldogbend/ //PS: see discussion
21 mins
Thanks. "Considering the context" Why?
agree philgoddard : Bulldog. The asker should have Googled this.
1 hr
yep
agree Tony M : Yes, it would not be safe or desirable to seek to translate the meaning on a word-by-word basis, and presumably this was an isolated fragment overhead by the writer with no further context, so a reader of the translation needs to be in the same situation
1 hr
exactly. Thanks
agree Andrew Paul Kennett : Yes could well be. From the text, there seems to be multiple conversations. So this could be a bribe of a conversation over heard amongst others.
2 hrs
"bribe" of a conversation?
neutral Christopher Schröder : Yes but why is it mentioned? See discussion...
23 hrs
Conjecture
agree Anastasia Kalantzi
5 days
Thanks:-)
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "I've got a reply from the Author it refers to the River and also for a Poker game"
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