Oct 31, 2018 16:50
5 yrs ago
German term

1582 heiratet er die acht Jahre ältere Anne Hathaway,

Non-PRO German to English Art/Literary General / Conversation / Greetings / Letters Confused - eight years old, or eight years older?
What does this sentence actually say? Does it say "he marries the eight-year-old Anne Hathaway," or does it say "he marries Anne Hathaway, who is eight years older? We have a difference of opinion in our agency.

Thanks for your help!
Change log

Oct 31, 2018 16:54: Susan Welsh changed "Level" from "PRO" to "Non-PRO"

Votes to reclassify question as PRO/non-PRO:

Non-PRO (3): Helen Shiner, Julia Burgess, Susan Welsh

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Discussion

Björn Vrooman Nov 2, 2018:
Allegro I didn't need to be told what I already know (historical present and so on). BTW, there's a long ProZ thread about this and the ENS translator was thinking about removing her name from the book she translated because the author changed the tense over and over again.

It's annoying in German too. I didn't know we were supposed to make the text more difficult to read. Also, if you have a situation like this and the older partner dies 10 years earlier, who will be older in the end? You can avoid those semi-philosophical debates if you change the tense.

Best
AllegroTrans Nov 2, 2018:
She isn't roaming the streets of Stratford-on-Avon. As Lancashireman says, this excruciating present tense is being increasingly used, most especially on TV history documentaries.
Björn Vrooman Nov 2, 2018:
Agree with Lancashireman From the Shakespeare Birthplace Trust, of all places:
"William Shakespeare married Anne Hathaway in November 1582 and they remained married until Shakespeare's death. At the time of their marriage William was 18, while Anne was 26—and pregnant with their first child."
https://www.shakespeare.org.uk/explore-shakespeare/shakesped...

From Britannica:
"She was married to Shakespeare in November 1582, when he was 18 and when she, according to the sole evidence of an inscription on her gravestone, was 26. Their daughter Susanna was born the following May."
https://www.britannica.com/biography/Anne-Hathaway-wife-of-S...

"...who IS 8 years older/his senior" sounds truly odd, unless she is still roaming the streets of Stratford-upon-Avon. She's not the King of Rock'n'Roll.

Best
Lancashireman Oct 31, 2018:
Aargh, dramatic present! All history programmes on TV now employ this device. Irritating but also satisfying when some History professor (who should know better) delivers a minute-long account that eventually reverts to the past tense through sheer lack of sustainability.

Proposed translations

+8
23 mins
Selected

In 1582, he marries Anne Hathaway, who is 8 years his senior.

I’m confused- what is not to understand here?
Note from asker:
It turns out that my translator omitted a word by mistake. None of us speak German at the office and we couldn't reach her, and our client was saying that the meaning was wrong. Everything is clear now. Thanks again for your feedback!
Peer comment(s):

agree Armorel Young : The best version
32 mins
agree franglish
35 mins
agree Sarah Bessioud
45 mins
agree Michele Fauble
1 hr
agree Michael Martin, MA : With Armorel
1 hr
agree AllegroTrans
5 hrs
agree Ramey Rieger (X)
14 hrs
agree Steffen Walter : https://history-biography.com/william-shakespeare (although the quality of the English used in this contribution is poor in some instances)
1 day 21 mins
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
4 mins

He marries Anne Hathaway, who is eight year older then him.

IMHO....
Note from asker:
Thank you!
Peer comment(s):

neutral Steffen Walter : ... years older than him
1 day 40 mins
Thank you, sure, a typo when typing on the phone.... :)
Something went wrong...
+5
3 mins

he marries Anne Hathaway, who is eight years older

In case of any doubt, confirmed by Wikipedia :)

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 8 mins (2018-10-31 16:59:06 GMT)
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If she were eight years old, the German would read: die achtjährige Anne Hathaway (or perhaps: die acht Jahre alte Anne Hathaway). älter(e) is a comparative form.
Note from asker:
Very helpful, thank you!
Peer comment(s):

agree Mair A-W (PhD)
0 min
agree philgoddard
23 mins
agree Thomas Pfann : Eindeutig. The German sentence leaves no room for any other interpretation.
48 mins
agree Michele Fauble
1 hr
agree Steffen Walter : ... who is eight years older than him - https://history-biography.com/william-shakespeare/
1 day 41 mins
Something went wrong...
9 mins

eight years his senior, he marries Anne Hathaway in 1582

Just for literary diversity.
Note from asker:
Thank you!
Peer comment(s):

neutral AllegroTrans : Not "wrong" but somewhat unnatural sounding, as well as potentially confusing if read or said quickly.There are much clearer ways to render this one
5 hrs
Something went wrong...
+4
7 hrs

"In 1582, he wed Anne Hathaway, eight years his elder".

Sounds more romantic and poetic that way. Compare with this:

"At age 18 Shakespeare married Anne Hathaway, a woman eight years his elder who was already pregnant with their daughter Susanna."
https://www.coursehero.com/lit/The-Two-Gentlemen-of-Verona/a...
Peer comment(s):

agree Lancashireman : Thank you for the past tense.
13 hrs
agree Steffen Walter
17 hrs
agree Björn Vrooman : She's dead.//Confused: Why do you want to argue something that isn't in dispute?//Ah. Frankly, I don't. Of course, you can use it, but it sounds awkward here. I was tempted to add the now-famous quote "I see dead people" to all other answers.
1 day 10 hrs
It's not impossible to use historical present in English but it gets more awkward when specific times in the past are mentioned/Relax, Björn. I am agreeing, not arguing. Just showing that I understand where others are coming from
agree Joe France
1 day 13 hrs
Something went wrong...
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