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This question was closed without grading. Reason: No acceptable answer
Feb 5, 2004 20:50
20 yrs ago
8 viewers *
English term

USA, the U.S., the USA

English Social Sciences Geography
The context is surely clear in this case. For my "feeling", only the first two on this list are the correct abbreviations. Is that right? I see more and more often "the USA" - and it doesn't sound right to me. Am I right or wrong to correct something like "... in the USA" when proofreading?
Responses
5 +17 the U.S.A
4 +4 the USA
3 +5 (The) US or USA depending on contaxt
4 +2 the USA/the US
3 +2 the US; the USA
3 -1 USA; United States of North America

Discussion

Todd Field Feb 10, 2004:
Dangerous to base decisions on google hits... google often omits common English words like "the" entirely... good luck!
Todd Field Feb 10, 2004:
As a native English speaker I recommend following the advice of colleagues here if you want an accurate translation
RHELLER Feb 10, 2004:
IF YOU KNEW THE ANSWER, WHY DID YOU ASK THE QUESTION? When I said that all three were correct I meant that all three preceded by "THE" are correct.
Non-ProZ.com Feb 10, 2004:
I said, I agree with you that context "dictates" when and when not to use an article. But you didn't make an effort to define the context even roughly. Delving deeper myself, I think it doesn't always make a difference. But it is becoming clearer to me when it makes a difference and how.

As a comment to your answer, Rita Heller said all three are correct - the only totally correct comment that I can find here, but very sparce and also not related to the "context" issue. In a later comment she says the opposite, namely that "the is required".

Neither did any of the three links which you gave deal with this linguistic detail of the use of the article or not. All in all, I was hoping for some friendly help. But I feel this has turned out to be a very disagreeable discussion. Let's just leave it as it is! This is beginning to be indigestive. If you want to have it in the glossary, then please enter the subject and discuss it again for yourselves! :-)
Jean-Luc Dumont Feb 9, 2004:
Well, then, it seems to me that my answer was not bad at all - although you did not deem it worthy :-)
Non-ProZ.com Feb 9, 2004:
What I have learned are two things:
- to write "the USA" is not incorrect (asking Google for "born in USA" and "born in the USA" one gets 4.4 million hits and the same ones each time, whereby it looks to me as if more are without the article); also interesting to try "in support of USA" and "USA is set to win" or "the USA are")
- some of you are vastly mistaken in saying it is "incorrect" to use "USA" without an article, i.e. that to use an article is mandatory - do think you should check that before being so imperative!
RHELLER Feb 9, 2004:
the is required before USA! USA won the race is INCORRECT! I was born and educated in the U.S.A. and I live here. You can believe me.
Non-ProZ.com Feb 6, 2004:
Somehow we never got the responses coordinated to the question. Maybe in part my fault, because I basically proposed two concepts:
1) "USA" + "the U.S." are correct
2) "the USA" is not correct
The Answerers say that my proposal 2) is wrong, but haven't proved it. I think that I've given several examples that do question it. To my proposal 1) the majority seem to reject "USA" without an article. But again without proof.

I do think it would not be right to send this to the glossary in that state.

Responses

+17
2 mins

the U.S.A

Declined
The States

The United States

the United States of America

In fact my father still calls it the U.S. of A. :-)

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 mins (2004-02-05 20:53:46 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

in other words, you need the definite article \"the\"
Peer comment(s):
agree jerrie : 'Born in the USA'..
1 min
good point ! thanks !
agree rene_teews : of course don't forget the final dot after A. ;-)
2 mins
good point ! thanks !
agree tazdog (X)
3 mins
Thanks!
agree pike
4 mins
thanks !
agree Fuad Yahya : Unless it is used as a modfier of an indefinite noun, as in "U.S. soldiers were treated to a Thanksgiving dinner."
4 mins
good point ! thanks !
agree Todd Field
8 mins
thanks!
agree Armorel Young
15 mins
thanks !
agree Empty Whiskey Glass
33 mins
thanks !
agree Charlie Bavington
40 mins
thanks!
agree MJ Barber : no dots necessary
51 mins
true - thanks!
agree blabli blablou : we use THE for countries whose name includes a common noun (the USA,, The United Arab Emirates....)
58 mins
true - thanks!
agree perke
2 hrs
thanks!
agree Nikita Kobrin : Chuck Berry: 'Back in the U.S.A.'
2 hrs
thanks !
agree Rajan Chopra
4 hrs
thanks !
agree David Russi
5 hrs
thanks!
agree Attila Piróth
11 hrs
Thanks!
agree Jeannie Graham
12 hrs
thanks to all!
Something went wrong...
Comment: "Even if you are all riveted to that, it doesn't have to have an article. Try using a verb - "are" matches all of them except not in "the USA are ...". In a statement like "USA is bound to win this race" it could also be "The USA is bound to win this race" - but wouldn't the first version be more likely?"
+4
4 mins

the USA

Declined
it is known as "the" United States of America, so in my opinion, the USA is the more correct abbreviation, although "the" US is also widely used
Peer comment(s):
agree Todd Field
6 mins
thank you
agree horizon
1 hr
agree Nikita Kobrin
2 hrs
agree Rajan Chopra
4 hrs
Something went wrong...
Comment: "same applies as above"
+5
10 mins

(The) US or USA depending on contaxt

Declined
United States of America - Government
... Country name: conventional long form: United States of America conventional
short form: United States abbreviation: US or USA. Government ...
www.exxun.com/UnitedStates/d_gv.html - 17k - Cached - Similar pages


United States of America definition of United States of America. ...
... recall - the act of removing an official by petition. ... long form: United States of
America conventional short form: United States abbreviation: US or USA. ...
www.thefreedictionary.com/ United%20States%20of%20America - 70k -


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 14 mins (2004-02-05 21:05:36 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Maybe they know: :-)

CIA - The World Factbook -- United States
... United States of America conventional short form: United States abbreviation: US or USA.
Government type: Definition Field Listing Constitution-based federal ...
www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/us.html - 101k - Cached - Similar pages
Peer comment(s):
agree verbis
7 mins
thanks/grazie
agree RHELLER : all three are correct; "of America" is understood when not spelled out
50 mins
agree Rajan Chopra
4 hrs
agree Gordon Darroch (X)
12 hrs
agree Todd Field : absolutely right
4 days
Something went wrong...
Comment: "Thanks for the links, but it is really a question of usage. That may be shifting. I agree that the "context" dictates whether to use an article or not. But we have the problem here that my feeling for context differs from yours. Like Jerrie above, I was also "born in USA" - probably in a different era. But that doesn't get us anywhere either "
-1
18 mins

USA; United States of North America

Declined
I know it sounds odd, but for being fully correct, you should change it into "United States of North America"

If I'm well informed Mexico, Brazil and the United Arab Emirates (Estados Unidos Mexicanas, Rep¨²blica Federativa do Brasil (before 1966: Estados unidos do Brasil), and al-Im¨¡r¨¡t al-`Arabiyah al-Muttahidah) are United States as well.

So, writing US would formally give an 25 % chance the country between Canada and Mexico is mentioned, whereas writing USA would give an 33.3 % chance the reader would understand the United States of North America are mentioned.

Not mentioning the concerning country might render a lot of problems in a contract.

On the other hand: there's theory and there's practice

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2004-02-06 09:51:15 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Also possible: write the name the first time you\'ll find it in the document, fully:
the United States of America (hereafter \"the USA\")
the United States of America (hereafter \"USA\")
the United States of America (heerafter \"the US\")
the United States of America (hereafter \"US\")

and write futheron the short form (the) US(A)


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2004-02-10 13:54:44 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Todd and Monica:
good that you put a signal red \"disagree\" before your comment, and give the to your opinion proper term. The phrase \"Canada has..\" namely seem to back the \"North hypothesis\", because it says Canada are no United States, implying \"North\" satisfies to avoid confusion with Mexico (Central America) and Brazil (South America).
Peer comment(s):
neutral RHELLER : there is no entity called the United States of North America - North America is the name of the continent
2 hrs
how pitty
disagree Todd Field : Canada has "provinces"... also, in correct English, the proper term is absolutely "The United States of America"
4 days
Be sure I like your disagree. Good wine needs no bush. On the other side, I wonder what kerry would have to do with wine. And please don't sneeze at the danger of Mad Cow Disease
Something went wrong...
Comment: "You sure are right about the problem of multiple countries using the words "United States" in their names! Same problem with "America" isn't it? Thank you for reminding me that Mexico uses it too! This is some good thinking from another perspective, but it doesn't give me the solution I need either. "
+2
3 hrs

the USA/the US

Declined
the United States (of America), the USA
[In my experience, 'the US' is quite common in spoken English, as is 'the UK' (the United Kingdom)]

There is a whole item of English grammar devoted to 'the' and names of places...

Here is the grammar explanation from Murphy,'Essential Grammar in Use', Cambridge University Press:

'1 Places (continents/countries/states/islands/cities/towns/villages etc.)
Usually we do not say 'the' + names of places;
eg
- France is a very large country. (not the France)
- Cairo is the capital of Egypt.
- Corsica is an island in the Mediterranean

But we say the + republic/states/kingdom:
eg
the Republic of Ireland/the Irish Republic
the United States (of America)(the USA)
the United Kingdom (the UK)

2 Places in towns (streets/buildings etc.)
...

3 Seas, rivers etc.
...

4 the...of...
We say the + names with ...of...
eg
the Republic of Ireland
the Great Wall of China
the Bank of England
the Tower of London
...

5 the -s (plural names)
...'

Based on this, the use of 'the' follows the conventions of 1 and 4.
Reference:

Murphy,'Essential Grammar in Use', Cambridge University Press

Peer comment(s):
agree Todd Field
4 days
agree jebeen
22 days
Something went wrong...
Comment: "In 1) Murphy doesn't explain anything and also doesn't say that the article is mandatory (which it isn't). 4) gives us a clue why we say "the USA ..." but also does not exclude "USA". I think the difference comes in whether you want to consider it as 50 states or as one entity. "USA" is the whole thing, not the 50 united states - and the whole nation USA doesn't take an article. Everyone knows it without an article! Just like "Made in USA" - something can never have been made in all 50 states simultaneously so couldn't really ever be "Made in the USA" - at least not logically. "Made in England" vs "Made in the UK" - same logic. Your Murphy helped some, so I would like to give you some points, but then this would go into the glossary as if there were no way to say just plain "in USA". I'm not convinced that's right and wouldn't like to be the cause of more confusion among non-native speakers, so have to decline here too. "
+2
1 day 7 hrs

the US; the USA

Collins Cobuild New Student's Dictionary:
'You do use 'the' with many proper nouns referring to geographical places.'
...
You use 'the' with countries whose names include words such as 'kingdom', 'republic', 'states' or 'union'.
eg the United Kingdom; the Soviet Union
(its mandatory)

Cambridge Advanced Learner's Dictionary:
the US = (abbreviation for) the United States eg A new study of education in the US has just been published. When did you become a US citizen?
the USA = (abbreviation for) the United States of America
the USAF = (abbreviation for) the United States Air Force

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day 7 hrs 42 mins (2004-02-07 04:32:39 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Correction: it\'s mandatory

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 days (2004-02-10 02:37:01 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Ha, ha, possibly this is it. You will often find US/USA without the article in newspaper headlines - this is a special abbreviated form of English...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 days (2004-02-10 02:38:25 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

You can also see from above \'when did you become a US citizen?\' that it can be used without the article as an adjective (like, when did you become an American/French...citizen?)
Peer comment(s):
agree Todd Field
2 days 21 hrs
agree NancyLynn
2 days 21 hrs
Something went wrong...
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