althergebracht

English translation: rehashed / hackneyed

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
German term or phrase:althergebracht
English translation:rehashed / hackneyed
Entered by: Elizabeth Niklewska

10:55 May 26, 2020
German to English translations [PRO]
Law/Patents - Law (general)
German term or phrase: althergebracht
This is in a court's critical assessment of a convicted defendant's arguments in his application for a retrial:

"Diese Argumentation erweist sich im Kern entweder als *althergebracht* - und damit verbraucht - oder aber als gegenüber dem sonstigen Vortrag des Antragstellers so widersprüchlich, dass hierauf eine Wiederaufnahme des Verfahrens nicht gestützt werden kann."

"althergebracht" is translated as "established", "traditional", "old fashioned", which don't fit here.
I have thought of "rehashed" as in that the applicant is reusing old arguments (although the inappropriately informal "old hat" first came to mind!).
Elizabeth Niklewska
United Kingdom
Local time: 07:01
run-of-the-mill; hackneyed ('claptrap')
Explanation:
Having had a spell in journalism myself im 'alten Zeitalter' and recalling this idiom from the Judgend-, Familien- & Strafgericht series on RTL Plus TV., I agree as usual with Björn V's discussion posts of 'old and tired' arguments. The judge seems to be saying 'we have heard this nonsense all before'....
Selected response from:

Adrian MM.
Austria
Grading comment
Yes, the judge was saying 'we have heard this nonsense all before', so you have got the right spirit.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
3 +4conventional
Michael Martin, MA
3 +3repetitive
Birgit Gläser
3 +2belaboured
Catriona C.
3 +2obsolete/obsolescent
Ramey Rieger (X)
4run-of-the-mill; hackneyed ('claptrap')
Adrian MM.
3 +1regurgitated
Klaus Beyer
3 +1overworked
Rhys Mudie
3 +1used previously
Abdussabur Kirke
4Repetitious
Asmaa Hussein
4time-honoured (criticising tone)
Chris Pr
3quaint, odd, strange, obsolete, constrained
Dr. Jozsef Dikter


Discussion entries: 6





  

Answers


46 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +2
belaboured


Explanation:
Perhaps something along the lines of the idiom 'to belabour the point'? I see that it is occasionally used as an adjective although this is rare.


    https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/belabour
Catriona C.
Germany
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Chris Pr
1 hr

agree  Lancashireman
6 hrs
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58 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +2
obsolete/obsolescent


Explanation:
Or even:

unimpressive
prosaic

Ramey Rieger (X)
Germany
Local time: 08:01
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 59

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Dr. Jozsef Dikter: Depnding on text environment it also may however mean like "odd", or "not really accepted". I put my own solution to be judged :)
5 hrs

neutral  Eleanore Strauss: I would not have come up with that. It's more about something traditional that goes way back. It's not really negative. but just my 2 cents
7 hrs

agree  AllegroTrans: obsolescent seems to encapsulate the idea
8 hrs
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +3
repetitive


Explanation:
The way I understand it, they keep trotting out the same argument over and over again and it is thus moot, because it did not fly already during the first trial... This argumentation is in it's core repetitive and thus moot...

Birgit Gläser
Germany
Local time: 08:01
Native speaker of: Native in GermanGerman
PRO pts in category: 25

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Conny Reilly
55 mins

agree  Dr. Jozsef Dikter: Depnding on text environment it also may however mean like "odd", or "not really accepted". I put my own solution to be judged :)
5 hrs

agree  Asmaa Hussein
1 day 1 hr
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
run-of-the-mill; hackneyed ('claptrap')


Explanation:
Having had a spell in journalism myself im 'alten Zeitalter' and recalling this idiom from the Judgend-, Familien- & Strafgericht series on RTL Plus TV., I agree as usual with Björn V's discussion posts of 'old and tired' arguments. The judge seems to be saying 'we have heard this nonsense all before'....


Example sentence(s):
  • Gefundene Synonyme: altehrwürdig, althergebracht, altüberliefert, angestammt, gebräuchlich, *gewöhnlich*, hergebracht, herkömmlich, klassisch, konventionell

    Reference: http://www.dict.cc/englisch-deutsch/hackneyed.html
    Reference: http://www.openthesaurus.de/synonyme/althergebracht
Adrian MM.
Austria
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 115
Grading comment
Yes, the judge was saying 'we have heard this nonsense all before', so you have got the right spirit.
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3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +1
regurgitated


Explanation:
or "shop-worn" or "discredited"

Another possibility

Klaus Beyer
United States
Local time: 01:01
Works in field
Native speaker of: English

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  TonyTK
15 hrs
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7 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
quaint, odd, strange, obsolete, constrained


Explanation:
I agree with those who catch it as obsolete. Have seen however the word althergebracht translated as surprisingly odd, without any disapprobative meaning.

It apparently stems from herbringen, which suggests some playground with added meanings as far-fetched or overwrought (constrained)

As my mother tongue is neither German nor English, please consider NOT judging my helpful hint as on mere grammatical grounds or ill-willed contest. Even those Hungarian or fake-German linguists, bitte :)

Example sentence(s):
  • Auf dem Boden zu sitzen mag althergebracht erscheinen, ist aber nicht unbedingt für die westliche Anatomie geeignet.
  • Sitting on the ground may seem quaint, but it is not always suited to the Western anatomy.
Dr. Jozsef Dikter
Hungary
Local time: 08:01
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Hungarian

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  AllegroTrans: Disparate array of words - which of them fits the specific context?
2 hrs
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14 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +1
overworked


Explanation:
in the sense of "overused". This suggestion assumes "althergebracht" means the defendant has overused certain arguments (i.e. failed to produce new arguments). May not be appropriate if "althergebracht" instead refers to an argument that is generally overused or clichéd.

Rhys Mudie
New Zealand
Local time: 18:01
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
Notes to answerer
Asker: Yes, it is the defendant that has overused certain arguments


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Johanna Timm, PhD
20 hrs
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18 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +1
used previously


Explanation:
In essence, this argument has either been used previously, rendering it obsolete, or....

Abdussabur Kirke
Local time: 07:01
Works in field
Native speaker of: English

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Asmaa Hussein
8 hrs
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1 day 3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
Repetitious


Explanation:
characterized or marked by repetition

Asmaa Hussein
Germany
Local time: 08:01
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in GermanGerman
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46 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +4
conventional


Explanation:
"...argument is a conventional one, and hence washed up.."

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day 10 hrs (2020-05-27 21:05:16 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

"Essentially, this argument appears to be either a conventional one - and therefore a quickly exhausted one..."

Michael Martin, MA
United States
Local time: 02:01
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in GermanGerman, Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 364

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  philgoddard: Or you could just say "old".
58 mins
  -> Or it gets old quickly, as in 'verbraucht'

agree  Inge Luus
1 hr
  -> Thank you, Inge!

agree  Edith Kelly
4 hrs
  -> Thanks, Edith!

agree  Eleanore Strauss: I would have said traditional... but conventional is good
8 hrs
  -> Hi Elli. Good to hear from you!

neutral  AllegroTrans: too weak in context
8 hrs
  -> I can only translate what's actually there. Looks like a lot of people couldn't make up their mind whether to translate althergebracht or aufgebraucht

neutral  Birgit Gläser: I really think they mean arguments from the original trial not being admissible for reopneing the case.. also an argument is not void just because it is convenional or traditional...
1 day 8 hrs
  -> I hear you but this still feels like bending the normal confines of words just to suit our interpretation. There would have been better word choices out there to get those ideas across, no? BTW, I'd say 'aufgebraucht' means 'exhausted' rather than 'void'.
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14 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
time-honoured (criticising tone)


Explanation:
The term is used here as a thinly veiled insult, suggesting "not this old story yet again" etc...
Also listed by the Cambridge Dictionary for its critical property:
"The developers dealt with the problem in the time-honoured fashion/way, burying the industrial waste in landfill sites."
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/time-hon...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day 23 hrs (2020-05-28 10:36:27 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

...entweder als *althergebracht* - und damit verbraucht...

"...either as 'time-honoured' - and thus redundant - or..."

Chris Pr
United Kingdom
Local time: 07:01
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 24

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  AllegroTrans: 'Time-honoured' sounds like praise to me
8 hrs
  -> And 'obsolete' sounds patently wrong to me...
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