combined together for

English translation: both replaced by

05:05 Jan 5, 2006
English language (monolingual) [PRO]
Science - Chemistry; Chem Sci/Eng
English term or phrase: combined together for
If both R' and R'' are C(O)O-R''' then R''' both R' and R'' maybe combined into a single bivalent metal ion (such as Ca2+, as one non-limiting example) or a single trivalent metal overbase (such as Al-OH, for one non-limiting example). Preferably, R' and R'' are the same and R''' is either Na+ or combined together for both R' and R'' and Ca2+.
What is "R''' is either Na+ or combined together for both R' and R'' and Ca2+" means?

Thanks in advance!
Bill Lao
Local time: 21:48
Selected answer:both replaced by
Explanation:
The English of your text is abominable. I hope the rest isn't as bad. It looks as if a non-chemist has written it because it is certainly not in "chemspeak".


It is difficult to interpret this without a full chemical formula, but it looks as if there is a X-C-R' as well as a X-C-R'' moiety in the compound. If the R' and R'' are replaced by C(O)O-R''' (an ester or a carboxylate group/salt) this would give

two X-C-C(O)O-R'''

where the two R''' groups are either 2 Na(+) ions or a single bivalent ion, such as Ca(2+), or a single trivalent group, such as Al-OH(2+). I presume this is a salt, as Ca(2+) ions do not usually form complexes, i.e. this would actually be charge-balancing.


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 hrs 29 mins (2006-01-05 09:34:43 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

perhaps "both represented by" is better than replaced. If was more concerned with the explanation here

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 8 hrs 24 mins (2006-01-05 13:29:34 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

The meaning is quite clear from the second sentence. The first sentence only needs a slight correction to make more sense (see **) (still pretty awful)

If both R' and R'' are C(O)O-R''', then R''' *in* both R' and R'' maybe combined into a single bivalent metal ion (such as Ca2+, as one non-limiting example) or a single trivalent metal overbase (such as Al-OH, for one non-limiting example). Preferably, R' and R'' are the same and R''' is either Na+ or combined together for both R' and R'' and Ca2+.
Selected response from:

Gillian Scheibelein
Germany
Local time: 14:48
Grading comment
thanks
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



SUMMARY OF ALL EXPLANATIONS PROVIDED
5Road of clap
Richard Benham
4 +1both replaced by
Gillian Scheibelein
4some references
airmailrpl


Discussion entries: 3





  

Answers


1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
some references


Explanation:
AllRefer Health - Serum Sodium (Na+, Sodium - Serum) - Test ...
Serum Sodium (Na+, Sodium - Serum) information center covers description, preparation, risks, expectations, special considerations, normal and abnormal ...
health.allrefer.com/health/serum-sodium-info.html

calcium ions (Ca2+) definition
calcium ions (Ca2+). Definition:. Search for:. Glossary - word, Glossary - def, Textbooks, Protocols, Images, Tools, Forum, PubMed, Links, Press Releases ...
www.biochem.northwestern.edu/holmgren/Glossary/Definitions/...

Biochem. J. (1981) 200, 99-107 - Phillips JH - Transport of Ca2+ ...
Transport of Ca2+ and Na+ across the chromaffin-granule membrane. ... Na+ induces Ca2+ efflux; Ca2+ can re-enter the ghosts by a process of Ca2+/Na+ ...
www.biochemj.org/bj/200/bj2000099.htm

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr 16 mins (2006-01-05 06:21:48 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

What is "R''' is either Na+ or combined together for both R' and R'' and Ca2+" means? =>

What DOES
"R''' is either Na+ or combined together for both R' and R'' and Ca2+" mean?

airmailrpl
Brazil
Local time: 10:48
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in PortuguesePortuguese
PRO pts in category: 16
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

5 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5
Road of clap


Explanation:
The English text, to make sense, requires that two substituted carboxyl groups can be combined to form a metallic ion. This, of course, is impossible (at least in chemistry: maybe a nuclear physicist might be able to have a shot at it).

I would strongly advise you to tell the client that the text is rubbish, and therefore cannot be translated into any language.

While I am here, I would remind everybody that "maybe" is an adverb, more or less synonymous with "perhaps". If you mean "may be", you should write "may be" as two words.

Richard Benham
France
Local time: 14:48
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Gillian Scheibelein: it is not the 2 carboxyl groups being combined, but the R''' salt on the end i.e. 2 x COO(-) plus either 2 x Na( ) or 1 x Ca(2 ) or 1 x Al-OH(2 )
17 mins
  -> Wrong! R' and R'' are both carboxyl groups, and they, not R''', are being combined into, not with, the metallic ion (or whatever). Read the text!
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

4 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
both replaced by


Explanation:
The English of your text is abominable. I hope the rest isn't as bad. It looks as if a non-chemist has written it because it is certainly not in "chemspeak".


It is difficult to interpret this without a full chemical formula, but it looks as if there is a X-C-R' as well as a X-C-R'' moiety in the compound. If the R' and R'' are replaced by C(O)O-R''' (an ester or a carboxylate group/salt) this would give

two X-C-C(O)O-R'''

where the two R''' groups are either 2 Na(+) ions or a single bivalent ion, such as Ca(2+), or a single trivalent group, such as Al-OH(2+). I presume this is a salt, as Ca(2+) ions do not usually form complexes, i.e. this would actually be charge-balancing.


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 hrs 29 mins (2006-01-05 09:34:43 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

perhaps "both represented by" is better than replaced. If was more concerned with the explanation here

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 8 hrs 24 mins (2006-01-05 13:29:34 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

The meaning is quite clear from the second sentence. The first sentence only needs a slight correction to make more sense (see **) (still pretty awful)

If both R' and R'' are C(O)O-R''', then R''' *in* both R' and R'' maybe combined into a single bivalent metal ion (such as Ca2+, as one non-limiting example) or a single trivalent metal overbase (such as Al-OH, for one non-limiting example). Preferably, R' and R'' are the same and R''' is either Na+ or combined together for both R' and R'' and Ca2+.


Gillian Scheibelein
Germany
Local time: 14:48
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 99
Grading comment
thanks

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Veronica Prpic Uhing
6 hrs
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)



Login or register (free and only takes a few minutes) to participate in this question.

You will also have access to many other tools and opportunities designed for those who have language-related jobs (or are passionate about them). Participation is free and the site has a strict confidentiality policy.

KudoZ™ translation help

The KudoZ network provides a framework for translators and others to assist each other with translations or explanations of terms and short phrases.


See also:
Term search
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs
  • Forums
  • Multiple search