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hypothecair ingeschreven

English translation: registered as a mortgage, mortgage-registered, registered for mortgage purposes

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
Dutch term or phrase:hypothecair ingeschreven
English translation:registered as a mortgage, mortgage-registered, registered for mortgage purposes
Entered by: Emma Rault (X)

15:18 Aug 30, 2015
Dutch to English translations [PRO]
Bus/Financial - Real Estate
Dutch term or phrase: hypothecair ingeschreven
Once again I've got a contextual question, and maybe I'm being nitpicky here, but:

"De klant heeft een woning en heeft daarvoor een box 1 lening die hypothecair is ingeschreven bij een andere geldverstrekker."

Hypothecair ingeschreven = mortgaged to, fine.
But: isn't it the *property* which is mortgaged to the creditor, rather than the loan/mortgage itself?
I.e., they hold a charge over the *property*, not over the loan/mortgage?

Similarly, my source text talks about an investment account which is "verpand aan de hypotheek".
Isn't it pledged to the *mortgagee*, rather than to the *mortgage*?

Am I on the right track, or am I losing my marbles? :-)
Emma Rault (X)
United Kingdom
Local time: 15:37
(BrE) registered > (AmE) recordated > as a mortgage
Explanation:
You 'like' your mortgages, don't you, Emma?

My tentative answers:

1 Hypothecair ingeschreven = mortgaged to > no. The loan is regd. as a mortgage advance - no difference with EN law, however the mortgage is regd. over the land;

2. "verpand aan de hypotheek" Isn't it pledged to the *mortgagee*, rather than to the *mortgage*? No. The loan is charged to the mortgage - cf. my 'all monies' charge answer.

3. better steer clear of the term of pledge, unless you are sure that moveable property is in there (even EN co. shares or legalistically 'mortgaged' - see any UK co. or business law textbook) or we have a US legendary film starring Rod Steiger: 'The Pawnbroker' scenario.

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Note added at 14 mins (2015-08-30 15:32:54 GMT)
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EN co. shares *are* legalistically

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 hrs (2015-08-30 18:29:48 GMT)
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1. 'Mortgage advance' - I used just to vary with the word loan extended under the mortgage, namely an advance (loan instal(l)ment) will be inscribed, so registered or recorded as a mortgage entry.

2. Yes indeed, the investment a/c acts as collateral and the client's 'pledged asset' translation is taken: so (literally) the a/c is pledged to the mortgage - which wording, like you, I had doubts about.

But I reckoned that investment a/c 'charged' to the mortgage doubles better as meaning both *assigned* as part of and charged up as a debt to the mortgage.

Quaere: making a US verb out of the a/c 'liened' to the mortgage.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 hrs (2015-08-30 18:57:12 GMT)
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1. mortgage-registered or regd. for mortgage purposes.

2. indeed: the investment a/c is (like assignment of book debts in the UK) assigned or pledged to the mortgage lender, namely mortgagee, so perhaps to retain the Dutch original and the mechanics of the dealing:

'collateralis/zed to top up the mortgage' or 'used as collateral to secure the mortgage'.



--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 5 hrs (2015-08-30 20:43:33 GMT)
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Steer clear of pledge: not in this case as 1. an investment a/c is personal or moveable property and 2. is client-advocated. I find that 'charge' often works well in BrE, esp. when there is a 1st, 2nd and 3rd-priority 'pand'.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 5 hrs (2015-08-30 20:51:59 GMT)
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'Hang on': I'm afraid my Dutch isn't up to deciphering the passage you quote. But, if your interpretation is right, then the a/c is collateralis/zed or used as collateral in 'discharge' of the mortgage.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 9 days (2015-09-08 21:29:53 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

Grappling question: first consider an open-ended rather than open-end mortgage. Second, I don't know the mechanics of Dutch mortgages, but it may be safer to play with a term like the 'registered amount of the mortgage' for hypothecaire inschrijving, pace Kitty B. The reason is that, certainly in the UK, it is not a limit or total amount but can be topped-up by extra advances (loans).
Selected response from:

Adrian MM. (X)
Local time: 16:37
Grading comment
Many thanks again for your help.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
3 +1(BrE) registered > (AmE) recordated > as a mortgage
Adrian MM. (X)
Summary of reference entries provided
hypothecaire inschrijving
Kitty Brussaard

Discussion entries: 5





  

Answers


13 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +1
(BrE) registered > (AmE) recordated > as a mortgage


Explanation:
You 'like' your mortgages, don't you, Emma?

My tentative answers:

1 Hypothecair ingeschreven = mortgaged to > no. The loan is regd. as a mortgage advance - no difference with EN law, however the mortgage is regd. over the land;

2. "verpand aan de hypotheek" Isn't it pledged to the *mortgagee*, rather than to the *mortgage*? No. The loan is charged to the mortgage - cf. my 'all monies' charge answer.

3. better steer clear of the term of pledge, unless you are sure that moveable property is in there (even EN co. shares or legalistically 'mortgaged' - see any UK co. or business law textbook) or we have a US legendary film starring Rod Steiger: 'The Pawnbroker' scenario.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 14 mins (2015-08-30 15:32:54 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

EN co. shares *are* legalistically

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 hrs (2015-08-30 18:29:48 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

1. 'Mortgage advance' - I used just to vary with the word loan extended under the mortgage, namely an advance (loan instal(l)ment) will be inscribed, so registered or recorded as a mortgage entry.

2. Yes indeed, the investment a/c acts as collateral and the client's 'pledged asset' translation is taken: so (literally) the a/c is pledged to the mortgage - which wording, like you, I had doubts about.

But I reckoned that investment a/c 'charged' to the mortgage doubles better as meaning both *assigned* as part of and charged up as a debt to the mortgage.

Quaere: making a US verb out of the a/c 'liened' to the mortgage.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 hrs (2015-08-30 18:57:12 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

1. mortgage-registered or regd. for mortgage purposes.

2. indeed: the investment a/c is (like assignment of book debts in the UK) assigned or pledged to the mortgage lender, namely mortgagee, so perhaps to retain the Dutch original and the mechanics of the dealing:

'collateralis/zed to top up the mortgage' or 'used as collateral to secure the mortgage'.



--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 5 hrs (2015-08-30 20:43:33 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Steer clear of pledge: not in this case as 1. an investment a/c is personal or moveable property and 2. is client-advocated. I find that 'charge' often works well in BrE, esp. when there is a 1st, 2nd and 3rd-priority 'pand'.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 5 hrs (2015-08-30 20:51:59 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

'Hang on': I'm afraid my Dutch isn't up to deciphering the passage you quote. But, if your interpretation is right, then the a/c is collateralis/zed or used as collateral in 'discharge' of the mortgage.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 9 days (2015-09-08 21:29:53 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

Grappling question: first consider an open-ended rather than open-end mortgage. Second, I don't know the mechanics of Dutch mortgages, but it may be safer to play with a term like the 'registered amount of the mortgage' for hypothecaire inschrijving, pace Kitty B. The reason is that, certainly in the UK, it is not a limit or total amount but can be topped-up by extra advances (loans).


    Reference: http://www.proz.com/kudoz/dutch_to_english/other/78786-inges...
Adrian MM. (X)
Local time: 16:37
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 63
Grading comment
Many thanks again for your help.
Notes to answerer
Asker: 1. Okay, I get that. That was a misreading of/failure to understand the "hypothecair ingeschreven" phrase on my part. I don't quite understand your use of the term "advance" here, though. . .? 2&3. Sorry, I don't follow. Verpanden = het in onderpand geven. My client's terminology list gives "pledged asset" for "verpande zaak". We're talking about a situation in which an investment account functions as collatoral., no?

Asker: Het in onderpand geven van een zaak ter zekerheid van terugbetaling, I mean. and collatEral. Ahh! Typos galore!

Asker: 1. So you reckon the correct way to say "hypothecair ingeschreven" would be to say "the loan is registered as a mortgage"? With "registered as a mortgage" effectively meaning: gives the lender a charge over the property for which the loan is being used? 2. What do you mean by "assigned as part of"? And I'm still confused with regard to my original query: isn't it pledged to the mortgage provider? See for example this link: "A secured loan is a loan where an asset is pledged to the lender as collateral." https://www.netcredit.com/glossary/long-term-personal-loan/

Asker: Amazing. Thank you. One final question: so why exactly were you advising me to steer clear of the term "pledge" in your first comment? I lack the detailed legal background to understand exactly what you were trying to say there.

Asker: Hang on. Sorry. Actually, I'm not sure whether "used as collateral to secure the mortgage" is what they mean when they say "verpand aan de hypotheek". I think they mean: where the investment account will be used to *pay off* the mortgage at the end. Check this: "Let op: als de klant een verzekering of een beleggingsrekening heeft die is verpand aan de hypotheek, gebruiken we de waarde van de verzekering of de beleggingen niet om de hoogte van de lening te berekenen. We doen dit alleen als de klant echt aflost."

Asker: Hi again. I thought I was done resolving my conundrums relating to this term, but unfortunately not. I'm now grappling with the following: the current section of the text describes what happens in the case of outstanding mortgage debts with different lenders. It says that for open-end mortgages, the mortgage debt = "het bedrag van de hypothecaire inschrijving". Am I right in thinking that means the full amount, i.e. the *limit* of the open-end facility? And if so, is "full registered amount" clear and unequivocal enoguh, or am I better off using the word "limit" or somesuch?


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Kitty Brussaard: See also my reference comment re hypothecaire inschrijving
1 day 10 hrs
  -> Dank u vel!
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Reference comments


1 day 10 hrs
Reference: hypothecaire inschrijving

Reference information:
Wat is een hypothecaire inschrijving?
Een hypotheek wordt ingeschreven in het zogenaamde hypotheekregister. Daarin staat het bedrag en perso(o)n(en) die de hypotheek is/zijn aangegaan. Men kent meerdere soorten inschrijving: de bankhypotheek, de krediethypotheek en de vaste inschrijving.

De hypothecaire inschrijving is het moment waarop de hypotheek van kracht wordt en er een vermelding in het hypotheekregister komt aan wie en voor welk bedrag een recht van hypotheek is verleend.

Het recht van hypotheek is een beperkt recht dat kan worden gevestigd op registergoederen. Een hypotheekrecht kan gevestigd worden op onroerende zaken, zoals een woning.
https://www.hypotheker.nl/begrippenlijst/huis-kopen/hypothec...

JurLex:

hypothecaire inschrijving
registration of mortgage,
perfection of mortgage by registration

inschrijving van een hypotheek
registration of a mortgage,
perfection of a mortgage by registration

inschrijving in het hypotheekregister
entry in the mortgage register

Kitty Brussaard
Netherlands
Native speaker of: Native in DutchDutch
PRO pts in category: 36
Note to reference poster
Asker: Ja, *natuurlijk*! De verbinding met het hypotheekregister had ik niet concreet gemaakt (is op andere punten in de tekst wel weer sprake van), maar je hebt helemaal gelijk. Wil je hiermee zeggen dat jij voor de "meest conservatieve" optie zou gaan en het helemaal "languit" zou weergeven als "entered in the mortgage register"?

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