This site uses cookies.
Some of these cookies are essential to the operation of the site,
while others help to improve your experience by providing insights into how the site is being used.
For more information, please see the ProZ.com privacy policy.
English translation: created at virtually molecular level
10:08 Feb 23, 2018
Dutch to English translations [PRO] Tech/Engineering - Chemistry; Chem Sci/Eng / pyrolysis (carbon fibre)
Dutch term or phrase:opgespoten tot een bijna moleculair niveau
This is actually a very creatively written catalogue about decorative lighting made from carbon fibre (really beautiful). Here, the focus is on some technical info, specifically how carbon fibre is made.
In het productieprocédé - pyrolyse: een goedbewaard geheim, zelfs toverkunst genoemd - worden die vezels onder heel hoge druk en een temperatuur van 3.000° **opgespoten tot een bijna moleculair niveau**.
Opgespoten seems to make no sense. I've been asked to translate this job quite freely, so can anyone suggest how to (re)phrase this. Current translation (but not sure if ** is correct): Carbon fibre is made by a chemical process called pyrolysis – a well-kept secret with almost magical overtones – in which the fibres are heated at 3000°C and under very high pressure **until thermal decomposition**.
Based on Kitty's info, I moved away from the source (which didn't seem correct to me) and the artist himself OK'd "[pyrolysis] ... in which, under very high pressure and at a temperature of 3000°C, precursor fibres (e.g. acrylic) are transformed into carbon fibre at molecular level." He actually changed "at almost the molecular level" to "at molecular level". Thanks to you all - and particularly Kitty - for the discussion and extra info. 1 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer
To put your linguistic and scientific conscience even more to rest, consider the following. '24K' means that the carbon fibre tow consists of 24,000 fibre filaments, each with a diameter of approx. 5-8 micrometres (µm). Not quite as small as molecules (where diameters range from a few to several hundreds of nanometres) but definitely 12-20 times smaller than the average diameter of (a strand of) human hair :-).
I've done all I can: lacking any further explanation of the source by the client, I submitted the translation and added a detailed note about this sentence. Today I received the text with a couple of comments from the client, one of which was about deleting "almost the [molecular level]". You really don't have to think about it any more ;-)
I understand Barend's doubts given that pyrolysis is described in the source as a process involving high-temperature heating as well as high pressure. Assuming that this describes the process which is used to produce carbon fibres, the reference to high pressure seems indeed a bit odd. Most publications on this subject only mention that pyrolysis of precursor fibres (to produce carbon fibres) requires high temperatures and oxygen-free conditions. In fact, this led me to second-guess my initial assumptions/comments and wonder if Barend wasn't on the right track after all.
However, triggered by the latest entries, I've just come across an article which seems to support Moira's translation (as approved by the artist/author):
Carbon fiber production using high pressure treatment of a precursor material
A process for producing a carbon fiber includes the steps of heat treating a selected precursor material under high pressure (...). https://patents.google.com/patent/US4402928
Since carbonization is a pyrolytic reaction, it is considered a complex process in which many reactions take place concurrently such as dehydrogenation, condensation, hydrogen transfer and isomerization.
For the final pyrolysis temperature, the amount of heat applied controls the degree of carbonization and the residual content of foreign elements. For example, at T ∼ 1200 K the carbon content of the residue exceeds a mass fraction of 90 wt.%, whereas at T ∼ 1600 K more than 99 wt.% carbon is found.
Do you trust the correctness of this: 'under very high pressure and at a temperature of 3000°C, precursor fibres (e.g. acrylic) are transformed into carbon fibre at molecular level'
Which is by the way a huge change from what it said.
The primary element of CFRP is a carbon filament; this is produced from a precursor polymer such as polyacrylonitrile (PAN), rayon, or petroleum pitch. For synthetic polymers such as PAN or rayon, the precursor is first spun into filament yarns, using chemical and mechanical processes to initially align the polymer chains in a way to enhance the final physical properties of the completed carbon fiber. Precursor compositions and mechanical processes used during spinning filament yarns may vary among manufacturers. After drawing or spinning, the polymer filament yarns are then heated to drive off non-carbon atoms (carbonization), producing the final carbon fiber. The carbon fibers filament yarns may be further treated to improve handling qualities, then wound on to bobbins.[8] From these fibers, a unidirectional sheet is created. These sheets are layered onto each other in a quasi-isotropic layup, e.g. 0°, +60° or −60° relative to each other.
in which, under very high pressure and at a temperature of 3000°C, precursor fibres (e.g. acrylic) are transformed into carbon fibre at molecular level.
you would need to change the preceding sentence as well, since 24K carbon fibres occurs in the preceding sentence rather than 'precursor fibres'.
Don't worry about it Barend, it's a lighting catalogue, and either written by a nuclear physicist with no knowledge of marketing, or a marketer with bugger all knowledge of science. Applying Occam's razor, and going with the second plausible hypothesis, it is more than obvious that the writer is a creative genius who invents words.
Not the first time I've come across total BS bad science in marketing blurb.
C) then it would need to add up with this: Please note, the resin is NOT sprayed on the 'koolstofvezels' here: Many CFRP parts are created with a single layer of carbon fabric that is backed with fiberglass. A tool called a chopper gun is used to quickly create these composite parts. Once a thin shell is created out of carbon fiber (this would need to involve these 24K vezels), the chopper gun cuts rolls of fiberglass into short lengths and sprays resin at the same time, so that the fiberglass and resin are mixed on the spot. The resin is either external mix, wherein the hardener and resin are sprayed separately, or internal mixed, which requires cleaning after every use. Manufacturing methods may include the following: o 2.1 Molding o 2.2 Vacuum bagging o 2.3 Compression molding o 2.4 Filament winding
If Kitty's reading is right, and it may be right, it means that this is complete bullshit:
De diktewaarde bedraagt 24K, 24.000 vezels, met een schaar door te knippen. In het productieprocédé - pyrolyse: een goedbewaard geheim, zelfs toverkunst genoemd - worden die vezels onder heel hoge druk en een temperatuur van 3.000° opgespoten tot een bijna moleculair niveau.
A) pyrolysis is a well-known and very old process B) the whole thing would need to be divided into two separate processes: 1) In het productieprocédé - pyrolyse: een goedbewaard geheim, zelfs toverkunst genoemd - worden die vezels onder heel hoge druk (??) en een temperatuur van 3.000° geproduceerd 2) daarna worden ze opgespoten tot moleculair niveau (which could then be read as something like 'de opspuitlaag zal op moleculair niveau versmelten met het product (koolstofvezels) dat wordt opgespoten'). C) then it would need to add up with this: (see next entry)
In my study material, I find 3 situations where the present continuous is used:
1) something is going on at the moment of speaking
- Don't talk to me, I am making a telephone call
2) a previously arranged action will take place in the near future
- I have bought tickets; we are leaving tomorrow. - She's having a baby
3) in combination with adverbs as always, constantly, for ever
- He is always telling the same old stories - The neighbours are constantly fighting.
I do think things also depend on what you want to say, whether you want to be factual or present things in a more actual way. For non-native speakers it is often a matter of stop and think.
I do think as well that:
this would work better:
a substance is being injected into something
than:
something is being injected with a substance
In that case this would work better:
...under a very high pressure and at a temperature of 3.000° C, a substance is being/is injected into these fibres, down to an almost molecular level.
British Geological Survey, Kingsley Dunham Centre, Keyworth, Nottingham, United Kingdom, NG 12 5GG.
The principles established from the generic modelling were then applied to a real aquifer storage operation at Sleipner in the North Sea. Here CO2 is being injected into the Utsira Sand, a large relatively homogeneous reservoir.
You'd only use this structure for something like a commentary on a video describing a process actually underway (the sheep are being sheared), something else continually happening (your patience is being tested :) ), or an overarching description of something happening in the past, usually while something else was going on. (The car was being repaired when the garage caught fire etc.)
Thermal insulating material is being injected into a pre-made single-block cooling counter housing to form a uniform insulation, which leaves no gap for the cold to escape. It is the fundamental feature of highly efficient Novameta cooling count
... and what is this 'are being injected', second time you've used it? That is completely inappropriate (e.g.wrong) grammar, we use the simple present to describe processes
I doubt if it's that magic Barend, this looks like shoddy popular science from a marketer, I doubt if anything is being 'sprayed' at a molecular level, and nobody will be reading it to find out more about this magical process. That is why I would keep it vague with 'created'.
I remove my last comment since this seems be more about infusing existing fibers with some substance, rather than epoxy reinforced with carbon fibres (although may still be kept in mind).
This is what your text seems to say:
De diktewaarde bedraagt 24K, 24.000 vezels, met een schaar door te knippen. In het productieprocédé - pyrolyse: een goedbewaard geheim, zelfs toverkunst genoemd - worden die vezels onder heel hoge druk en een temperatuur van 3.000° opgespoten tot een bijna moleculair niveau.
....these fibres, under a very high pressure and a temperature of 3.000° C, are being injected with [substance] down to an almost molecular level.
De diktewaarde bedraagt 24K, 24.000 vezels, met een schaar door te knippen. In het productieprocédé - pyrolyse: een goedbewaard geheim, zelfs toverkunst genoemd - worden die vezels onder heel hoge druk en een temperatuur van 3.000° opgespoten tot een bijna moleculair niveau.
Also keep in mind that they talk about a type of 'pyrolysis' that is a well-kept secret.
And at 3.000° C 'pyrolysis' occurs anyway, provided an inert atmosphere is present.
I would like to add nowhere else you find 'a very high pressure', which might be used here to inject this stuff in the already existing fibers.
I think you may be on the wrong track, Barend, possibly because the source text is unclear/incorrect. Plenty of web evidence: "Koolstofvezels worden gemaakt uit acrylvezels die door middel van pyrolyse bij temperaturen tot 3000 graden Celsius verkoold worden." https://carbonsailing.nl/carbon/
very high pressure en very high temperature both make injecting likely.
Apart from this it says that these 24K fibers 'worden opgespoten'
These fibres are not being produced, they exist already and are being processed.
De diktewaarde bedraagt 24K, 24.000 vezels, met een schaar door te knippen. In het productieprocédé - pyrolyse: een goedbewaard geheim, zelfs toverkunst genoemd - worden die vezels onder heel hoge druk en een temperatuur van 3.000° opgespoten tot een bijna moleculair niveau.
I really don't think that it makes sense to say that 'die vezels onder heel hoge druk en een temperatuur van 3.000°' refers to the carbon fibres being subject to pyrolysis. Rather, pyrolysis is used to obtain carbon fibre (as the resulting material) from carbonaceous precursor fibres (being subject to pyrolysis).
I also think that 'opgespoten' refers to the next step: the spray lay-up process which involves the use of a chop/spray gun to produce the carbon fibre/epoxy composite which is applied onto the (surface of the) mould and left to cure for three days.
Again, see for instance: Engineering firm Pratt & Miller have developed a new and previously untested carbon fiber/epoxy composite using a spray lay-up process similar to a process commonly used in fiberglass production. This new composite is made by using a pneumatic chop gun that simultaneously cuts the carbon fibers to a specific length and deposits the chopped fibers and resin onto surface of an exposed mold surface. http://digitalcommons.calpoly.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?articl...
24K vezels worden onder heel hoge druk en een temperatuur van 3.000° opgespoten tot een bijna moleculair niveau.
This suggests that some substance (epoxyhars?) is injected, down to an almost molecular level (of the fibres), under very high pressure and a temperature of 3.000° C, into these 24K carbon fibres.
In the sense that it is clear now what 'die vezels' refer back to.
De diktewaarde bedraagt 24K, 24.000 vezels, met een schaar door te knippen. In het productieprocédé - pyrolyse: een goedbewaard geheim, zelfs toverkunst genoemd - worden die vezels onder heel hoge druk en een temperatuur van 3.000° opgespoten tot een bijna moleculair niveau.
Klassiek geweven carbon of koolstof weefsels hebben een hoge treksterkte, hoge stijfheid (modulus), laag gewicht, een lage thermische uitzettingscoëfficiënt, zijn elektrisch geleidend en bestand tegen hoge temperaturen. Deze ongeëvenaarde eigenschappen hebben koolstofweefsels tot favoriet gemaakt in de tegenwoordige composieten industrie. Carbon weefsels in combinatie met een hars matrix, vaak epoxyhars, kunnen worden toegepast in een breed scala van producten waar een laag gewicht in combinatie met hoge sterkte en stijfheid nodig is. Compositesplaza’s carbon weefsels zijn beschikbaar in zowel Toray carbon fiber als Aksaca industriële koolstof vezel, in verschillende weefpatronen (vierkant en keper), veel verschillende gramgewichten van 60 g/m2 tot 600 g/m2 en in breedtes van 100, 120, 128 en 154 cm. Geweven van koolstofvezels van 1K vezel tot 24K vezel.
for all the discussion so far. I think it's clear we're talking about the general process of producing carbon fibre, as the text then goes on to briefly mention what this particular artist then does. Here's what comes before and after in case it helps (doubtful). Copywriter of this does seem to have confused carbon (koolstof) with carbon fibre (carbon). "In carbon, een van de weinige elementen die al sinds de oudheid bekend zijn, steekt een unieke diversiteit aan organische verbindingen. Carbon hoort thuis bij de niet-metalen en is koninklijk duur, wordt ook de koning van de elementen genoemd. De diktewaarde bedraagt 24K, 24.000 vezels, met een schaar door te knippen. In het productieprocédé - pyrolyse: (...) De geheime artisanale productie vereist een omgevingstemperatuur van 26° waarbij de draden carbon met epoxy worden vermengd. Vervolgens worden ze manueel aangebracht op een mal waarna de elementen drie dagen op een temperatuur van 60° uitharden." The result is huge carbon-fibre spheres, which are the decorative light fittings.
We really should look beyond the awkward/inaccurate wording of the source here. In this context (production of carbon fibre), the source terms 'pyrolyse' and 'die vezels' can only refer to the pyrolysis (carbonisation) of carbonaceous precursor fibres to produce carbon fibre.
As a next step (called 'spray lay-up', which is not part of the pyrolysis process as such), it seems that carbon fibres can be 'sprayed' onto a mould or part surface with a 'chop gun' that chops up the fibres and mixes them with a resin before being sprayed out.
Pratt & Miller Engineering (New Hudson, MI) has developed an untested method for making a discontinuous, or chopped, carbon fiber composite using a process widely used in fiberglass composite production. This process, commonly known as spray layup, utilizes a pneumatic chop gun that both chops the carbon fiber into small lengths and mixes them with resin before being sprayed out of the gun onto the surface of a mold. http://digitalcommons.calpoly.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?articl...
I know what generally is meant by 'opspuiten' and that is what I am talking about. And that's all we can talk about given the info we have. And when we talk about 'spuiten' we think of liquids, that may be applied as a jet, a spray, a mist, and in this case perhaps as 'molecular droplets'.
However, if you think you have a better explanation of what 'opspuiten' means here, you should simply come up with it, since this is the key problem and the key question.
Re: Anyway, the info Moira provided suggests a liquid is used to produce carbon fibers. This liquid undergoes pyrolysis before being applied.
I don't think this assumption (or is it a conclusion?) makes sense. As far as I can see, no mention is made of a liquid (undergoing pyrolysis), neither in the source nor by Moira herself ... Also, based on some internet research, I understand that carbon fibre is made from either precursor fibres (production process = pyrolysis) or from gaseous hydrocarbons (production process = chemical vapour deposition, CVD).
Based on the context information provided by Moira, I understand this part of her source text focuses specifically on how carbon fibre is made. I'm not sure if you've done any fact-checking yourself but based on my own research and given the reference to pyrolysis in the source text, this can only be about the production process which uses pyrolysis to produce carbon fibre from so-called precursor fibres, i.e. appropriate fibres with high carbon content such as acrylic fibres. In other words, there's no 'liquid' involved in this specific process and the starting material is already a fibre.
All that we know is that pyrolysis is used in the production of a fiber containing carbon or exclusively composed of carbon.
They don't necessarily start from fibers. If the stuff is being 'opgespoten' they more likely start from a liquid that is being 'opgespoten' in the shape of a fiber, and supposedly they are capable of 'opspuiten' this liquid in extremely tiny quantities, so that they can produce fibers in any shape and size they want.
I am just 'freethinking', as an alchemist should. :-)
In het productieprocédé - pyrolyse: een goedbewaard geheim, zelfs toverkunst genoemd - worden die vezels onder heel hoge druk en een temperatuur van 3.000° **opgespoten tot een bijna moleculair niveau**. >> Carbon fibre is made by a chemical process called pyrolysis – a well-kept secret with almost magical overtones – in which the fibres are heated at 3000°C and under very high pressure **until thermal decomposition**
If 'die vezels' refers back to 'koolstofvezels' (as your current translation suggests), this is not correct. Carbon fibre is the output of the pyrolysis process and not its input. The input, i.e. the starting material which is subject to pyrolysis, are the so-called 'precursor fibres' (or 'precursors' for short). See also my refs.
"Recovering Carbon Fibers. Which Way is the Right Way to Recycle CFRP?: Pyrolysis is currently considered to be the only process for recycling carbon-fiber-reinforced plastics (CFRP) that is available on an industrial scale." http://www.ict.fraunhofer.de/content/dam/ict/en/documents/I-...
That would be great if you could recycle plastic into carbon or oil Phil, would solve one of the great conundrums of our time. At the moment it's purely aspirational, but will probably be solved in the future.
If I understand it correctly, this is about recycling plastic by breaking it down at high temperatures (pyrolysis) to recover the fibres. So "tot" is correct: it's "opgespuiten" (whatever that is) into fibres of almost molecular thickness.
worden die vezels onder heel hoge druk en een temperatuur van 3.000° **opgespoten tot een bijna moleculair niveau
-->
worden die vezels onder heel hoge druk en een temperatuur van 3.000° **opgespoten vanaf/op een bijna moleculair niveau
That means these fibers are 'opgespoten' starting from/at a molecular level and proceeding from there until you end up with your fibre.
It seems to me that you need know the exact production process.
Basically 'opspuiten' would be 'spraying on'
Is this stuff sprayed on something?
Automatic update in 00:
Answers
1 hr confidence:
created at virtually molecular level
Explanation: 'opgespoten' must refer to the actual creation of individual fibres at almost molecular level. maybe you could refer to nanoscience too.
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 1 hr (2018-02-23 11:45:32 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
afaik pyrolysis inolves 'thermal decomposition', but this is about forming new products through this process
Richard Purdom Portugal Local time: 06:40 Native speaker of: English PRO pts in category: 1
Grading comment
Based on Kitty's info, I moved away from the source (which didn't seem correct to me) and the artist himself OK'd "[pyrolysis] ... in which, under very high pressure and at a temperature of 3000°C, precursor fibres (e.g. acrylic) are transformed into carbon fibre at molecular level." He actually changed "at almost the molecular level" to "at molecular level". Thanks to you all - and particularly Kitty - for the discussion and extra info.
Reference information: Carbon fibers are filaments of carbon that can be used to make very strong yarns and textiles. Carbon fiber items are often produced by spinning and weaving the desired item from fibers of a suitable polymer, and then pyrolyzing the material at a high temperature (from 1,500–3,000 °C or 2,730–5,430 °F). The first carbon fibers were made from rayon, but polyacrylonitrile has become the most common starting material. For their first workable electric lamps, Joseph Wilson Swan and Thomas Edison used carbon filaments made by pyrolysis of cotton yarns and bamboo splinters, respectively. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyrolysis
Carbon fibers can be manufactured by converting a precursor fiber, such as a spun polyacrylonitrile (PAN) fiber, in a multi-step process in which the precursor fiber is heated, oxidized, and carbonized to produce a fiber that is 90% or greater carbon. The resulting carbon fibers can be molded into high strength composite materials for structural applications, used in their pure form for electrical and friction applications, or can be further processed for use in adsorbent, filter, or other applications. In particular, composite materials have been developed in which carbon fibers serve as a reinforcing material in a resin, ceramic, or metal matrix. https://patents.google.com/patent/US20100254887
Kitty Brussaard Netherlands Native speaker of: Dutch PRO pts in category: 7
Login or register (free and only takes a few minutes) to participate in this question.
You will also have access to many other tools and opportunities designed for those who have language-related jobs
(or are passionate about them). Participation is free and the site has a strict confidentiality policy.