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Best CAT Tool for Mac?
Thread poster: Minna Helminen

Dominique Pivard  Identity Verified
Local time: 19:48
Finnish to French
Java tools ruled out? Sep 22, 2014

Tom in London wrote:
2. A graphical user interface that doesn't look like some horrible relic from the Windows world with_ all_those_underscores_and_that_Windows_typeface.

That would rule out a Java tool, wouldn't it? CAT tools are a niche market, and translators using a Mac are a niche within that niche (not to mention those translators who wouldn't use a CAT tool anyway).

In addition, it's a niche that is already crowded: translators on Mac can choose between the following JAVA-based tools (some of which are free): OmegaT, Heartsome, CafeTran, Swordfish, Wordfast Pro. They can also use Wordfast Classic (works under Word 2011) and any of the cloud-based tools out there (Wordfast Anywhere, MemSource etc.). Not to mention that virtualization technology works so well with modern hardware quite a few Mac using translators are happily using Windows tools (eg. Déjà Vu, memoQ, Trados). What room does that leave for a newcomer?
Tom in London wrote:
6. it should not cost the earth.

Not only would a newcomer face a number of established competitors, but they would have to sell at a low price. This just wouldn't add up. I'm afraid Mac users will have to find happiness in one of the tools already available today.


 

Michael Beijer  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:48
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
Simplicity is overrated. Sep 22, 2014

Fat lot of good hiding everything is going to do me when working on a 300-page software manual. And in any case, that's some comparison you did there: hide everything in Pages and show everything in MS Word …

Hey, look, Word can do it to (make itself 99% useless):

(MS Word 2013 on Win7)
(MS Word 2013 on Win7)

Michael


 

Michael Beijer  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:48
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
CafeTran: Java CAT tool with modern UI. Sep 22, 2014

Some might say CafeTran looks almost … Mac-like …

some_text

(CafeTran on Windows 7, on Java 8)


(1) = Termbase
(2) = The Grid (shows src text)
(3) = Google Translate
(4) Microsoft Translator
(5) = TM

Michael

PS: Yes, I know, my glossary is a mess; working on it!


 

Michael Beijer  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:48
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
@Dominique: Sep 22, 2014

Dominique Pivard wrote:

Tom in London wrote:
2. A graphical user interface that doesn't look like some horrible relic from the Windows world with_ all_those_underscores_and_that_Windows_typeface.

That would rule out a Java tool, wouldn't it? CAT tools are a niche market, and translators using a Mac are a niche within that niche (not to mention those translators who wouldn't use a CAT tool anyway).

In addition, it's a niche that is already crowded: translators on Mac can choose between the following JAVA-based tools (some of which are free): OmegaT, Heartsome, CafeTran, Swordfish, Wordfast Pro. They can also use Wordfast Classic (works under Word 2011) and any of the cloud-based tools out there (Wordfast Anywhere, MemSource etc.). Not to mention that virtualization technology works so well with modern hardware quite a few Mac using translators are happily using Windows tools (eg. Déjà Vu, memoQ, Trados). What room does that leave for a newcomer?
Tom in London wrote:
6. it should not cost the earth.

Not only would a newcomer face a number of established competitors, but they would have to sell at a low price. This just wouldn't add up. I'm afraid Mac users will have to find happiness in one of the tools already available today.


There are some very nice looking Java programs currently being developed; care to elaborate on that?

Michael


 

2nl (X)  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 18:48
Drag & Drop now available in CafeTran for Mac (and Windows) Sep 22, 2014

Tom in London wrote:

3. Completely automatic import (via drag-and-drop) of previously completed translations and memorisation of all the terminology used in them, without any need for user input (except perhaps for a query pop-up asking you how you want to save a particular phrase or term).
4. It should work directly with a range of normal files (eg. Word, Excel etc.) and not need a special file type of its own.


Please see here:

http://www.proz.com/forum/cafetran_support/275038-cafetran_now_offers_drag_drop_mac_and_windows.html


 

Dominique Pivard  Identity Verified
Local time: 19:48
Finnish to French
Native vs. ported/multiplatform Sep 22, 2014

Michael Beijer wrote:
There are some very nice looking Java programs currently being developed; care to elaborate on that?

"Very nice looking" won't cut it (for true Mac fanboys & girls), and as a Windows user, you can't appreciate nor understand good looks anyway

A truly native Mac application would need to be developed with the Cocoa Frameworks. As Apple explains:
"By developing with Cocoa, you will be creating applications the same way OS X itself is created. Your application will automatically inherit the great behaviors and appearances of OS X, with full access to the underlying power of the UNIX operating system. Using Cocoa with the Xcode IDE is simply the best way to create native Mac applications."
A Java-based tool will never "inherit the great behaviors and appearances of OS X", no matter how highly you think of it!


 

Dénis Wettmann  Identity Verified
Ireland
Local time: 18:48
Member (2016)
German to English
+ ...
😂 Apr 23, 2016

Tom in London wrote:

I don't like any of them because as a Mac user I expect things to be intuitive. I don't want to have to read instructions or learn stuff before using a piece of software. I'm used to things being easy. (That's what using a Mac does to people !)

CAT tools on the Mac have a long way to go before they become Mac-like.


I concur, I never got the concept why I should spend dozens of hours to learn an inconsistent user interface that will have changed substantially by the next major upgrade. I need to concentrate on my work as a translator and can not afford being held back by my work tools.

I found Memsource to be pretty decent for medium to large projects. It is also cloud based what makes it easy to work in teams since I often collaborate on projects with my spouse.

[Edited at 2016-04-23 09:04 GMT]


 

CafeTran Training (X)
Netherlands
Local time: 18:48
As a freelancer you are free to pick your tools Apr 23, 2016

Dénis Wettmann wrote:

I found Memsource to be pretty decent for medium to large projects. It is also cloud based what makes it easy to work in teams since I often collaborate on projects with my spouse.


Good for you! As a freelancer you are free to pick your own tools . Whatever suits your needs best.


 

Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:48
Member (2008)
Italian to English
I forgot to add... Apr 23, 2016

I'm adding this criterion because I notice that these discussion forums are heavily populated by support threads for various CAT tools, threads about problems people seem to be running into on a regular basis, or threads from people seeking help for things they just don't understand how to do.

A Mac-like CAT tool would not require any form of support. A tool is something you use to perform a task. If the tool itself is a problem, then it's no good.

[Edited at 2016-04-23 20:11
... See more
I'm adding this criterion because I notice that these discussion forums are heavily populated by support threads for various CAT tools, threads about problems people seem to be running into on a regular basis, or threads from people seeking help for things they just don't understand how to do.

A Mac-like CAT tool would not require any form of support. A tool is something you use to perform a task. If the tool itself is a problem, then it's no good.

[Edited at 2016-04-23 20:11 GMT]
Collapse


 

CafeTran Training (X)
Netherlands
Local time: 18:48
In an ideal world Apr 24, 2016

Tom in London wrote:

A Mac-like CAT tool would not require any form of support. A tool is something you use to perform a task. If the tool itself is a problem, then it's no good.


In an ideal world, this would be true. When you browse the Apple support forums, you will read about all kinds of problems with Apple's own apps (e.g. Mail, iCloud). Apple's operating system is very advanced and robust; its apps aren't always.


 

Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:48
Member (2008)
Italian to English
Ideas Apr 24, 2016

CafeTran Training wrote:

Tom in London wrote:

A Mac-like CAT tool would not require any form of support. A tool is something you use to perform a task. If the tool itself is a problem, then it's no good.


In an ideal world, this would be true. When you browse the Apple support forums, you will read about all kinds of problems with Apple's own apps (e.g. Mail, iCloud). Apple's operating system is very advanced and robust; its apps aren't always.


Speaking of which, I am already having some practical thoughts (rather than "I wish" thoughts) about how a CAT tool could work, using the inbuilt power of what you correctly describe as the "very advanced and robust" MacOS. If anyone with an Apple connection happens to read this and wants to discuss, feel free to contact me privately.

[Edited at 2016-04-24 07:40 GMT]


 

Meta Arkadia
Local time: 23:48
English to Indonesian
+ ...
AppleTrans Apr 24, 2016

Tom in London wrote:
If anyone with an Apple connection happens to read this


I don't think Apple is much interested. They launched AppleTrans in 2001. I couldn't make it work. In 2006, they launched the Intel version of it. I couldn't make it work, until about a year ago or so. I think it was rather advanced for 2001, and even for 2006, but few people used it, mainly because of a steep learning curve.

Cheers,

Hans


 

Meta Arkadia
Local time: 23:48
English to Indonesian
+ ...
And yes, Apr 24, 2016

I happen to know people in Cupertino, including a translation manager.

Cheers,

Hans


 

Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:48
Member (2008)
Italian to English
Apple Trans Apr 24, 2016

Meta Arkadia wrote:

I happen to know people in Cupertino, including a translation manager.

Cheers,

Hans


Yes, I know Apple itself isn't interested and for complicated legal reasons that relate to intellectual property, Apple doesn't accept proposals from just anyone for new applications.

I agree that Apple Trans wasn't much good but that was a long time ago. In my opinion recent innovations to the MacOS mean that it might be fairly simple to create an application that would use all of a translator's previous jobs (stored on the hard drive) to be used as a source for future translations. All it would need would be a GUI.

Would your acquaintance in Cupertino be interested in discussing? I'm not in this for the money - and I wouldn't like to see anyone else doing it for money.

[Edited at 2016-04-24 10:49 GMT]


 

Meta Arkadia
Local time: 23:48
English to Indonesian
+ ...
Developers, Developers, Developers Apr 24, 2016

Tom in London wrote:
I agree that Apple Trans wasn't much good


On the contrary. I think it was very good, I only found out far too late. And it's "developer software," not consumer software, which explains why it was rather difficult. Ever tried XCode?

Sent you a private message with the name of the translation manager.

Cheers,

Hans


 
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