| Pages sur ce sujet: < [1 2 3] > | Off topic: "rude"...an insult? Auteur du fil: Maha Arara
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jaymin
Canada
Local time: 22:56
allemand vers coréen
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| different background | Feb 13, 2010 |
I am working at an International school and I see most of conflicts and misunderstandings among cultures come from different backgrounds. People who were never exposed to a different culture won't be able to understand when the other party reacts differently. Specially, Asian background is quite different from North American culture, such as hand gestures, eye contact, body language, and communication.
So "rudeness" could mean "normal" in some way. ... See more I am working at an International school and I see most of conflicts and misunderstandings among cultures come from different backgrounds. People who were never exposed to a different culture won't be able to understand when the other party reacts differently. Specially, Asian background is quite different from North American culture, such as hand gestures, eye contact, body language, and communication.
So "rudeness" could mean "normal" in some way. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Jessica Noyes 
États-Unis
Local time: 22:56
Membre
espagnol vers anglais
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| As they say in KudoZ, more context, please! | Feb 13, 2010 |
Nicole Schnell wrote: What Exactly Did the Teacher Say?
Right now we are discussing hearsay only. Common sense vs. linguistics.
I would like to see the complete message myself.
Also, I would suggest reminding your friend to use great care in questioning or criticizing the teacher in front of the child; this can breed disrespect and make it harder for the child to learn anything in that classroom.
[Edited at 2010-02-13 16:54 GMT]
| | | | Abba Storgen (X)
États-Unis
Local time: 21:56
grec vers anglais
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| Not insulting | Feb 13, 2010 |
Not insulting at all. As a matter of fact:
A few years ago we started "not criticizing" the children, and as a result we have produced an entire generation of people who do not know what's right and what's wrong (they prefer the logical fallacy of "relativism" - they actually believe that everything is "relevant").
The whole concept of "Respect" is a set of behaviors that is taught in schools and families (we are not "born" with it), and it's different among cultures. ... See more Not insulting at all. As a matter of fact:
A few years ago we started "not criticizing" the children, and as a result we have produced an entire generation of people who do not know what's right and what's wrong (they prefer the logical fallacy of "relativism" - they actually believe that everything is "relevant").
The whole concept of "Respect" is a set of behaviors that is taught in schools and families (we are not "born" with it), and it's different among cultures. What is considered "respectful" in some cultures may not be in some other cultures. At any rate, it's taught and has to be taught if one wants to live in a society with necessary rules.
It's a breath of fresh air for a teacher to say things as they are (if they are correct)...
In the Anglo-Saxon and Northern European cultures this is not an "insult". It's typical characterization.
[Edited at 2010-02-13 17:09 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Ivana UK
Royaume-Uni
Local time: 03:56
Membre (2005)
italien vers anglais
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| Not an insult and to be honest I don't see how it could be construed as such. | Feb 13, 2010 |
- the teacher just wanted to alert the parents of the child's behaviour and most likely meant 'rude' in this sense:
speaking or behaving in a way that is not polite and is likely to offend or annoy people [= impolite]
In class the children have obviously been taught never to answer without first putting their hand up and being asked to answer. In this instance it looks like the child shouted out the answer without giving others a chance, which was seen as rude.
<... See more - the teacher just wanted to alert the parents of the child's behaviour and most likely meant 'rude' in this sense:
speaking or behaving in a way that is not polite and is likely to offend or annoy people [= impolite]
In class the children have obviously been taught never to answer without first putting their hand up and being asked to answer. In this instance it looks like the child shouted out the answer without giving others a chance, which was seen as rude.
P.S. Despite my name, I'm British and a native EN speaker. ▲ Collapse
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| What did the child do? | Feb 13, 2010 |
Honestly, if a teacher in an English-speaking environment says that the child was "rude", it was very probably that the child was beating or insulting or bullying other children. Instead of being concerned about putting a fight with the teacher, I would first arrange a meeting with child and the teacher to ascertain what happened.
As the husband of a teacher, to me this looks like the child's behaviour was clearly unacceptable and the note only reflects a tiny bit of what the... See more Honestly, if a teacher in an English-speaking environment says that the child was "rude", it was very probably that the child was beating or insulting or bullying other children. Instead of being concerned about putting a fight with the teacher, I would first arrange a meeting with child and the teacher to ascertain what happened.
As the husband of a teacher, to me this looks like the child's behaviour was clearly unacceptable and the note only reflects a tiny bit of what the child was doing. ▲ Collapse
| | | | liz askew
Royaume-Uni
Local time: 03:56
Membre (2007)
français vers anglais
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| rude - no insult | Feb 13, 2010 |
Teachers can describe pupils or children as rude, just like any of us can.
This is a way to describe unacceptable, impolite behaviour.
No it is not too strong.
Pupils and children (I have two) plus quite a few adults need to learn how to behave politely and respectfully.
The English use the word "rude" to describe poor behaviour. Just take a look at English newspapers and you will see it is not used as an "insult".
Liz Askew
... See more Teachers can describe pupils or children as rude, just like any of us can.
This is a way to describe unacceptable, impolite behaviour.
No it is not too strong.
Pupils and children (I have two) plus quite a few adults need to learn how to behave politely and respectfully.
The English use the word "rude" to describe poor behaviour. Just take a look at English newspapers and you will see it is not used as an "insult".
Liz Askew
p.s. I agree with Elftherios.
[Edited at 2010-02-13 21:15 GMT]
p.p.s. I am fed up with people of all types being rude.
[Edited at 2010-02-13 21:17 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Jeanie Eldon
Royaume-Uni
Local time: 03:56
allemand vers anglais
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| Oversensitive parent? | Feb 13, 2010 |
A teacher saying that a pupil is rude is not an insult. The child might have behaved in a way that was disruptive or inpolite.
I'm actually beginning to feel very sorry for this poor teacher who is only trying to do her job.
| | | | | Not proud of it, but | Feb 13, 2010 |
the teacher in question would probably have a fit in a classroom full of Dutch children
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Juliana Brown
Israël
Local time: 22:56
Membre (2007)
espagnol vers anglais
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liz askew wrote:
Teachers can describe pupils or children as rude, just like any of us can.
This is a way to describe unacceptable, impolite behaviour.
No it is not too strong.
Pupils and children (I have two) plus quite a few adults need to learn how to behave politely and respectfully.
The English use the word "rude" to describe poor behaviour. Just take a look at English newspapers and you will see it is not used as an "insult".
Liz Askew
p.s. I agree with Elftherios.
[Edited at 2010-02-13 21:15 GMT]
p.p.s. I am fed up with people of all types being rude.
[Edited at 2010-02-13 21:17 GMT]
I second the entire post! As the daughter of a teacher, wife of a lecturer and a former one myself, I would tend to first insist (firmly) on an explanation from my (possibly rude) child, before attacking the teacher.
Manners are non-negotiable (and Liz, I'm fed up as well).
| | | | Maha Arara
Royaume-Uni
Local time: 03:56
anglais vers arabe
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AUTEUR DU FIL | Can't thank you enough | Feb 13, 2010 |
Dear all,
I cannot thank you enough for your concern, precious input and the time you took to illuminate me on the subject, despite the fact that, unfortunately, I could not provide enough context or answer questions that some of you asked. I will get back to my friend with the outcome and I hope I will be able to tell you how she addressed the matter.
Grateful to each of you,
Maha
| | | | | A possible misunderstanding | Feb 13, 2010 |
Maha Ararat wrote:
Dear all,
I cannot thank you enough for your concern, precious input and the time you took to illuminate me on the subject, despite the fact that, unfortunately, I could not provide enough context or answer questions that some of you asked. I will get back to my friend with the outcome and I hope I will be able to tell you how she addressed the matter.
Grateful to each of you,
Maha
Dear Maha,
There is a good chance that all this is nothing more than a linguistic misunderstanding. It would be ideal if your friend gave us the exact contents of the note, as at least two other colleagues have already said.
| | | | | It is not necessary | Feb 14, 2010 |
Tomás Cano Binder, CT wrote:
Honestly, if a teacher in an English-speaking environment says that the child was "rude", it was very probably that the child was beating or insulting or bullying other children. Instead of being concerned about putting a fight with the teacher, I would first arrange a meeting with child and the teacher to ascertain what happened.
As the husband of a teacher, to me this looks like the child's behaviour was clearly unacceptable and the note only reflects a tiny bit of what the child was doing.
.. that the child done something wrong.
Within last 15 years, behaviours to the people who carry specific cultural and religional signs (I think you know this group) in most countries have been changed radically.
For example you may be kept for 3-4 hours in airport just because of your name.
When you walk in the streets and just visit the shops you may be disturbed by a policeman who asks you to come with him and you may lost 5 hours from your life.
I am not talking about the people who distinguish you from others and may show their unfair feelings to you by their words and turn your day with your family into a unhappy one.
The term rude is a subjective term and it's dimensions differ from person to person, from culture to culture.
So, teacher uses this word and defines the action according to his/her feelings, world-view, culture, understanding of perfectness.
A teacher has no right to use such subjective terms.
Theacher should define the action scientifically (I am sure there is an objective definition in pedagogy).
For example:
-Go to a different teacher and describe the same situation exacly without using the word "rude". This teacher would use another word to describe the same situation. You may find 100 teachers who use 100 different words for the same situation (if you ask their point of view).
[Edited at 2010-02-14 02:43 GMT]
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sarandor
États-Unis
Local time: 22:56
anglais vers russe
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| Inappropriate choice of words | Feb 14, 2010 |
I would not defend the teacher's choice of words without knowing exactly what she meant by "rude". It could be a case of a linguistic misunderstanding, but as a teacher in a culturally diverse school she should be more sensitive to these issues. Cultural sensitivity and political correctness are new social norms that help us function in today's society, like it or not. Just like having good old good manners. There are many other, more appropriate, ways to tell parents that the behavior of their ... See more I would not defend the teacher's choice of words without knowing exactly what she meant by "rude". It could be a case of a linguistic misunderstanding, but as a teacher in a culturally diverse school she should be more sensitive to these issues. Cultural sensitivity and political correctness are new social norms that help us function in today's society, like it or not. Just like having good old good manners. There are many other, more appropriate, ways to tell parents that the behavior of their child is inappropriate. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Oh yes! There are other [pretty useless] ways! | Feb 14, 2010 |
Galia Williams wrote:
There are many other, more appropriate, ways to tell parents that the behavior of their child is inappropriate.
Yes, something like: "Your child is showing a magnificent command of the English language and body expression and is well able to find creative ways of putting up his alternative opinion about class methods and interaction with fellow members of the school community, overcoming social barriers by expressing his ideas at times not initially foreseen in the school's procedures."
Translated into non-politically-correctese: "You child insults and menaces everyone at all moments, both pupils and teachers."
No, I don't agree. Teachers are the society's last resource to teach rude children and youngsters some control, manners, and respect, where apparently parents are unable to find the courage to take control. Parent's overprotecting their rude children are responsible of teachers being stabbed and beaten. Let's put a stop to it!
[Edited at 2010-02-14 16:46 GMT]
| | | | Krzysztof Kajetanowicz (X)
Pologne
Local time: 04:56
anglais vers polonais
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Galia Williams wrote:
Cultural sensitivity and political correctness are new social norms that help us function in today's society, like it or not.
Care to elaborate on how political correctness helps us function in today's society?
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